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Author Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 13/10/2007 10:23:06
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Here is the long awaited Oldham LED Big Grin

http://www.gilgray.com.au/miners_caplamps.php

The big question of course is how will it compare to the Stenlight and the Scurion........
IP: 90.207.51.77
Vanoord

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 13/10/2007 13:21:46
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Any ideas which emitter it uses?

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Miles

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 14/10/2007 21:09:50
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Vanoord wrote:

Any ideas which emitter it uses?


luxeon 3w.
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Vanoord

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 15/10/2007 08:32:11
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Ta MM: I'll repeat my mutterings from elsewhere first:

I've just upgraded from a 3W Silva to a 5W one and d'y'know what? I think I might actually prefer the 3W one: none of this switching between modes, never having the right power setting, blinding everyone in tunnels, wrecking my night vision and so on.

The bit of the equation that I don't understand is that of battery power. Put the impressive lithium stuff and the latest Chinese emitters to one side for a moment. Light output has to come from battery capacity. For a given amount of light produced, you need to have a certain amount of batteries.

Massive light output over 12 to 14 hours means big, big batteries; or it means keeping the lamp reined back in order to prolong battery life; or, of course, you can just lug around a massive weight of battery packs. On the flip side, a less powerful lamp requires less battery reserves and is thus significantly lighter to carry.

Headlights with a daft output are all well and good for huge chambers, but I wonder of anyone actually needs that sort of power stuck to their head? Something of around 3W (or twin 3W to give a better spread) and a hand-held megatorch like the Underwater Kinetics Light Cannon 100 seems to be the best option.


Now them: I'd say that the new Oldham headset is going to be a very useful bit of kit. For sure it's not going to be as powerful as the Scurion, but not everyone wants to use their headlamp to cook with, whilst 12 hours or so on full chat is not to be sniffed at.

The Oldham's legendary indestructability has to be a plus point and it would be interesting to see how it stacks up against the Sten. Similarly, it looks like it's giong to have a good battery life, although that's obviously the result of using a heavier pack, which means belt mounting rather than helmet-mounting.

As with everything, it's horses for courses: I've used a 3W Silva for the last two years and I've found it near perfect or what I've been doing. Okay, if I were to go swimming, it probably wouldn't work; if I repeatedly bash it against a wall, it probably wouldn't work; and if I go into an explosive atmosphere, there's a good chance I'll cause a fireball. But in terms of light output and reliability, it's been great.

Yes, you can drive a Seoul P3 at a really impressive output, but the reliability becomes questionable, with a life of perhaps 1,000 hours. Even the 5W Luxeon Star and the Luxeon Rebel 100 are not yet proven, but the work done over the last year or so seems to have resolved most issues.

And that's where Oldham have got it right: the 3W Luxeon is a proven emitter, which has proven reliability and pretty much the most sensible level of light output / battery consumption. I can't help thinking that a pair of them is the ideal option, but the Oldham looks like it could be the first true alternative to, er... the original Oldham.

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madrab

Joined: 10/10/2007
Location: wiltshire

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 15/10/2007 22:31:07
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Does any one have a price from the website yet? A friend is down under at the moment and not far from the shop. I think i may have to give him a call. Smile IP: 195.93.21.71
jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 15/10/2007 22:43:34
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Oredered one direct from Enersys Odham over in Manchester.
They dont take card payment so you have to cough up upfront (they aren't set up for retail but will sell you one)
£107 odd inc VAT etc for headset to fit to my own battery.
Waiting with baited breathe for it to arrive so I can try it out
IP: 90.207.119.206
Mr Mike

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 17/10/2007 18:01:05
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It will be interesting to see the Oldham LED unit. Looked at the spec sheet and it claims 3W ~ 75 lm, which a bit poor unless they are being conservative??

Not meaning to plug the Retro2, but the new version uses 2 x 1W for a total of 200lm...
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Vanoord

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 17/10/2007 18:20:57
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mrmike wrote:

It will be interesting to see the Oldham LED unit. Looked at the spec sheet and it claims 3W ~ 75 lm, which a bit poor unless they are being conservative??


75 lumens from a 3W Luxeon sounds about right to me tbh - it's pretty much the same output as the Silva L1, which uses the same emitter.

Depending on the reflectors in the headset, the Oldham should produce a very useful amount of light - as I've said above, I think the 3W Luxeon is about right in terms of light output, unless you feel you need something related to a car headlamp on your head.

I'm looking forward to seeing it in use Smile

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jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 17/10/2007 19:58:47
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Vanoord wrote:

mrmike wrote:

It will be interesting to see the Oldham LED unit. Looked at the spec sheet and it claims 3W ~ 75 lm, which a bit poor unless they are being conservative??


75 lumens from a 3W Luxeon sounds about right to me tbh - it's pretty much the same output as the Silva L1, which uses the same emitter.

Depending on the reflectors in the headset, the Oldham should produce a very useful amount of light - as I've said above, I think the 3W Luxeon is about right in terms of light output, unless you feel you need something related to a car headlamp on your head.

I'm looking forward to seeing it in use Smile


It does puzzle me a little that the likes of the Retro claim 200 lumens for 2 x 1watt LED's yet a 3 watt LED can be rated at 75 lumens.
As I understand it lumens is connected to the angle of spread somehow too, but that makes little sense either as the Oldham angle is a 3rd or so of the Retro or Sten.
Personally I am hoping that a properly designed reflector in an LED lamp will produce the kind of lamp I have been waiting for. If it doesn't I shall just have to await the next development
Roll Eyes
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Mr Mike

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 18/10/2007 06:47:06
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Lumileds (makers of the Luxeon range) don't have the same output yet as some of the newer contenders. The data spec on the 3W luxeon state 65 lm @ 700mA and 80 lm @ 1000mA., where as the Cree 1W Leds have around 70lm @ 700mA. The P4 Seoul ones are probably the highest output / W at the moment, depending on which bin is used, the ones used in the Retro2 are binned at U which means a range of 91-118.5lm @350mA. You can get more output but the efficiency drops off after this. Side emitting LEDs have a little less output due to the reflector design in bending the light 90 deg or so. If you focus a light then it appears much brighter as everything is concentrated into a smaller area. IP: 79.65.97.38
jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 18/10/2007 08:08:05
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mrmike wrote:

Lumileds (makers of the Luxeon range) don't have the same output yet as some of the newer contenders. The data spec on the 3W luxeon state 65 lm @ 700mA and 80 lm @ 1000mA., where as the Cree 1W Leds have around 70lm @ 700mA. The P4 Seoul ones are probably the highest output / W at the moment, depending on which bin is used, the ones used in the Retro2 are binned at U which means a range of 91-118.5lm @350mA. You can get more output but the efficiency drops off after this. Side emitting LEDs have a little less output due to the reflector design in bending the light 90 deg or so. If you focus a light then it appears much brighter as everything is concentrated into a smaller area.


So the Watt rating of an LED can actually have little to do with its light output?
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Vanoord

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 18/10/2007 09:22:09
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jagman wrote:

So the Watt rating of an LED can actually have little to do with its light output?


As far as I understand it, yes.

Technology is moving very quickly though: the Fenix P3D flashlight originally used a Cree emitter which produced 160 lumens. It was replaced about a month ago by one with a Luxeon Rebel emitter at 200 lumens. Now there's a Cree Q5 emitter version on the way that's going to output 215 lumens.

But... if you sit around and wait for the next generation, you're never going to buy anything.

Now then, back to that Oldham. The 3W Luxeon it uses is very well proven and - most importantly - very reliable. The 5W version went through a long development process and had a lot of questions asked about how long it would last - although that seems to have been sorted now. All the same, my belief is that the 3W is possibly the best proven emitter at the moment.

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johnnym

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 13:25:51
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Hi Folks,

hoping to receive a demo version of the DL-16 within the next two weeks, when SRL returns from his Kalymnos trip. I'm sure he will invite as many of you guys as practicable to take a look at it.

A quick note to someone (can't remember who) who was concerned that Li-ion batteries won't last very long: I spoke to the Oldham rep. and he tells me that in the accelerated charge/discharge cycle tests the new Oldham Li-ion battery outlasted the most recent lead-acid incarnation.

And if you're still worried that Li-ions will blow up, catch fire, cause the enamel to flake off your teeth... well, they must be reasonably safe, 'cause the Oldham one has passed it's coal-mining safety certification.

Cheers,

JohnnyM

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Nobody, I mean nobody, catches a fish, and then, like, pets it to death. Nobody.
IP: 194.131.123.33
jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 14:03:38
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Good man johhnym
About time you boys started selling man fashioned lamps, this profusion of diddy little things currently the fashion is alarming.
As an aside isnt the Sten batterry Lithium Iron? and if so is it akin to mounting a small explosive charge inside the back of your helmet? Big Grin
IP: 90.207.104.99
ChrisP

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 14:16:29
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jagman wrote:

and if so is it akin to mounting a small explosive charge inside the back of your helmet?
In theory, but they're only dangerous if misused. Don't be scared! Smile

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jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 14:19:45
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ChrisP wrote:

jagman wrote:

and if so is it akin to mounting a small explosive charge inside the back of your helmet?
In theory, but they're only dangerous if misused. Don't be scared! Smile


I'm not, I dont have one!!!
The idea does amuse me a little though Shocked
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johnnym

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 15:16:51
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Yes, the StenLight batteries are indeed lithium ion (not iron, BTW), but less than 50 percent of them have exploded so far, and in most cases, as the user was an underground troll, there were very few brain cells to damage...

Seriously, Li-ion is the immediate future of portable power (unless you want to use aviation fuel). Toshiba have lodged a research patent for an Li-ion cell that can be recharged (to 100%) in less than ten minutes, AND can withstand 20,000 (yes, twenty thousand) charge/discharge cycles. When that filters through to our level, you'll have batteries that essentially last for ever, or at least, longer than you do.

What I hear about the Oldham DL-16 is this (will confirm/deny when we've tried it): the Li-ion battery is very large compared to others (Scurion/Sten), so belt mounting is mandatory (still much smaller/lighter than the Oldham lead/acid tho'). However, it can run at a realistic level for well over 20 hours, and under normal circumstances, will provide enough wallop to also power a ventilated helmet... Also, because it has a custom reflector, it has a really good spillbeam (although probably not as wide as the Scurion) and a tremendous 6º spot beam. You might want to note that it still doesn't have a pivot mount, so you gotta nod yer head plenty.

Me, I'd still prefer a reflectored StenLight (better for night biking, hillwalking, mountaineering etc. - the next shipment will include headstraps that will work for any blade-mounted light), and we (at Ex Stuff) are finally getting close to sourcing reflectors for the S7, which make a big difference (MUCH wider spillbeam, much better spot, much more light). Reflectors definitely have it over lenses, but they cost more as they almost invariably have to be custom made.

Final point. As Vanoord quite rightly says, you can have too much light. But you can't have too much battery life. So, if your LED emitter is super bright AND super efficient, the best thing you can do is turn it down a touch and never worry about a flat battery.

See you all at the BoDoD

JM

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jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 15:37:07
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Fear not Johnny I am awaiting delivery of my Oldham DT5 as we speak and have been encouraging Simon to look at them more closely.
On costs grounds I elected to get one to fit to one of my existing lead acid T6 batteries. I will probably eventually go to a DL16 once I have tried the LED headset for a while.
I am an Oldham man through and through, never bought an LED lamp yet because I haven't seen one that warrants replacing my Oldhams.
As for the DL16 battery size, I've felt the weight and its damned light, the size trade off I would be more than willing to make simply because of the 16ah capacity which compares very favourale with battery packs on Sten and Scurion alike.
As soon as mine arrives I will let you know what its really like Big Grin
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toadstone

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 19/10/2007 15:41:44
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We mustn't confuse the various forms of lithium battery available. As I understand it Lithium-ion batteries are OK and present no extra dangers than a normal type battery.

Lithium Polymer or Li-po batteries are however a different kettle of fish. These batteries are by nature unstable. However if you follow the prescribed methods of charging and discharging of these batteries then you should have no problems. You can get Li-po monitors that give audible/visual warnings when the battery condition gets too low. Discharge them too much and they will not recover.

Things like not using a dedicated charging system designed to charge Li-po 's will cause you problems. Charging should be done outside or at least on non combustible surfaces. I use a tin on a tile and certainly don't leave it to its own devices. Should these batteries go wrong they'll certainly catch fire possibly explode. Having said that I've only charged mine a couple of times. So I can only speak from limited experience. Another thing with them is its not advisable to use them if they have been subjected to impact damage.

The plus side to all this is that these batteries can store a vast amount of energy for their size/weight. Which is why they are very popular with the RC model guys.

If however you go on You Tube you will find all manner of clips of these things igniting and exploding.

I think it was Vanoord who questioned the need to have a searchlight nailed to ones head and really I can see his point. Yes all this technology is fantastic and its great to play with and I have experimented with other types of lighting but normal batteries systems with LEDs seems adequate to me. The Oldham system would appear to fit the bill as does the Retro unit.

If anyone is in doubt about this just found this on You Tube

[web link]
IP: 81.138.10.87 Edited: 19/10/2007 15:51:08 by toadstone
jagman

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Oldham DL-16 LED lamp
Posted: 09/11/2007 12:09:19
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My DT5 has just arrived Big Grin
Yet to try it in the dark but impressed so far Laugh
Will post further impressions later tonight!
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