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Mine Exploration Forum

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Author Responsible Exploration / sensitive sites.
ivortheengine

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Joined: 09/01/2012

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Posted: 11/04/2019 00:30:21
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Last week myself and some mates copped a bit of hassle in a Mid Wales pub from an Uneasy Local who'd been riled by the efforts of some high-profile yet frighteningly poorly equipped EweTube explorers.

Here they are, this time getting lost in Box.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIT7CVsgoqA&fbclid=IwAR3GuMuMFi82UM-xz_XUTv7X8v7NsdNYYyJZMI1wRVdObLCGHzNcF7jfc0o


A hard but fair comment followed, thus: "It's reasonable to presume - by your obvious lack of training or even the most basic knowledge and your hopelessly inadequate equipment - that you are not members of a caving club, therefore not covered by BCA insurance in the event that you need rescue.... something which is quite likely, given your general level of fucktardery. It is people like you, posting your worryingly poorly prepared exploits online for all to see, who scare landowners into permanently sealing these places up. And you have the brazen ignorance to point out that all your trips are self funded, with a request for donations! Guess what? Most normal mine explorers don't expect other people to pay for their hobby. Neither do they do it to satisfy a need for 'likes' on social media, they do it because they like it - themselves. Just remember that when the inevitable happens and you require rescue, it will be CRO members - people who are volunteers - who come to your aid... people whose hobby you are ******* up with your continuing needy habit of seeking approval via social media, for foolhardiness that normal people would be embarrassed of" and that was swiftly deleted. Clearly, a nerve has been hit and it was easier to block me (as they have done) than to address the points I'd raised.


As an Aspie I don't really get how to win people over, but is there any way of educating these types of people in order to lessen the chances of them being the cause of the next CRO call out, or concrete infill job? My original message comment isn't copyright and I have no issue with anyone who wants to cut & paste it onto their page to drive the message home :-D

IP: 87.115.67.179
Morlock

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Joined: 31/07/2008

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Posted: 11/04/2019 01:14:47
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Nothing can be done to educate these people.Cursing

Enjoyed one of the comments though.

"oh and leave bald grills behind".
IP: 109.149.64.46
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Posted: 11/04/2019 09:17:46
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There was somebody, not that lot, who uploaded footage taken in Cwmystwyth Lefel Fawr. Talking in whispers he describes how he is risking his life to reveal the secrets of the deadly place.

Few weeks later I was in there with a TV crew.
Laugh

--

Looking forward to NAMHO 2019. www.cambrianmines.co.uk
IP: 92.10.75.219
ttxela

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Joined: 04/09/2007
Location: Cambs

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Posted: 11/04/2019 09:27:18
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Mixed feelings on this, perhaps predictably.

I totally understand the frustration behind your comment and generally it’s pretty fair. Perhaps your tone though was not best calculated to promote engagement Laugh

I myself post videos on Youtube as do others on here, I do try to be discreet regarding locations and try and avoid the 'isn't being down here incredibly dangerous and scary' approach that some seem to take. Publicising yourself getting lost in Box has some obvious downsides! The whole ‘donate money’ thing is a little annoying too!

It is perhaps worth remembering though that we all started somewhere, probably a significant amount of us without proper equipment or much idea about conservation or access ethics - I know I did! It’s notable that the tone of even responsible sites such as this has shifted and matured over the last decade and a half or so! Not everyone wants or likes to be in a club and I don’t think BCA insurance is an issue as far as rescue goes (correct me if I’m wrong).

There is a threat to continued access from over publicity and increased footfall in these places - on the other hand there is a corresponding threat associated with being too secretive and exclusive. As a former target pistol shooter I have experience of the ease with which a pastime can be effectively banned following a tragic incident if the majority of people are unaware that it’s even a ‘thing’. I do find it alarming that many people will say “are you allowed to do that/should you really be doing that” when I talk to them about exploring old mines. I think an element of showing people how great these places are perhaps with a different message rather than ‘look how brave I am doing something a bit scary’ can be a good thing. The occasional appearance of places on TV does of course help this too Thumb Up

Ultimately we will pass on and these chaps will be the next generation that are interested in these places………

Haven't watched the video - I'll watch it later, is it a recent trip into box?
IP: 195.171.131.2 Edited: 11/04/2019 09:31:56 by ttxela
The Fresh Prince of Portreath

Joined: 05/08/2015

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Posted: 11/04/2019 13:24:09
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The interwebs has changed exploration forever, much as it has changed everything.

We need to shape it's direction, rather than harking back to the razzle-in-the-hedge days.

Where's my white stick!
IP: 185.253.98.94
sinker

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Joined: 13/12/2010
Location: North Wales.

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Posted: 11/04/2019 13:51:20
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The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:



…..the razzle-in-the-hedge days.



Innocent LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh

--

Ah, well, now, you see.... IP: 82.132.247.141
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Posted: 11/04/2019 14:19:26
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Use as you wish, its in my personal album.



(click image to open full size image in new window)

--

Looking forward to NAMHO 2019. www.cambrianmines.co.uk
IP: 92.10.75.219
ttxela

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Joined: 04/09/2007
Location: Cambs

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Posted: 11/04/2019 14:52:37
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sinker wrote:

The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:



…..the razzle-in-the-hedge days.



Innocent LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh


Must be a Cornish thing, here in Cambridgeshire we had arty black and white David Bailey coffee table books left amongst the azaleas.
IP: 195.171.131.2
alex17595

Joined: 05/01/2018

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Posted: 11/04/2019 14:57:20
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I think a large amount of these Youtubers/Social media people are just using it as a persona to get more views and therefore more money from it.
I could literally wander around a mine pointlessly and pretend I'm 'lost' for the viewers.

The internet has made these places more known to people - especially people like in the video. Area 51? Really? Your on the wrong continent mate. But overall I think it has done the hobby good - people can share their experiences of things like bad air or loose rocks.'
IP: 5.80.142.47
ttxela

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Location: Cambs

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Posted: 11/04/2019 15:24:31
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alex17595 wrote:

I think a large amount of these Youtubers/Social media people are just using it as a persona to get more views and therefore more money from it.
'


I fear they may be disappointed, I believe it's necessary to be a young attractive female recording yourself playing computer games in your pants to make anything more than pin money.

IP: 195.171.131.2
pedrgogh

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Joined: 31/08/2009
Location: S E England

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Posted: 11/04/2019 15:25:24
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I have never understood why people have the need to put things on the likes of you tube or the like.
Alright its nice to see how some thing is made but why would one want to see a load of odd balls doing some thing daft.
There plenty pictures and videos on responsible sites like this for those who have a genuine interest.
IP: 92.24.45.48
Mine donkey

Joined: 08/12/2015
Location: Consett

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Posted: 11/04/2019 15:55:20
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Spends a fortune on camera equipment. Nothing on a helmet!!! I really don’t understand these people. Or are they really just that ignorant to the danger they put them selves and potentially others in. IP: 213.205.241.61
Pete K

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Joined: 08/02/2009
Location: The Peak District or Snowdonia

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Posted: 11/04/2019 16:29:49
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In Derbyshire we've been dealing with an increase in break ins to locked mines which is probably linked in some way to increased publicity on social media and is attracting visits from different types of user groups to those who would traditionally visit these sites. As annoying as this is, we feel that it is down to us (DCA) to try to increase awareness of access systems and why sites need to be treated sensitively. There won't be a stop to the YouTube stuff so visits are likely to continue to increase. In that case, we should endeavour to educate 'other' types of user and be mindful of the content we share online.
I'd actually recently wrote something which I'd kind of hoped might start to find it's way into the 'other' circles, which the DCA has kindly published on their website.
https://thedca.org.uk/
We've begun to place small (iPhone size) plaques near some problem entrances directing people to access info and stating that there are reasons the mine has to stay secure from public access.
Feel free to share the link to the DCA site in the comments of any vids or posts you think would benefit to seeing the letter, or at least become aware of the DCAs existence. That is assuming you agree with my words.
Pete

--

Not seen the sun for months. Now evolving to see in the dark.
IP: 95.144.11.188
ttxela

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Posted: 11/04/2019 16:42:34
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That's a great letter Pete and deserves to be read more widely. IP: 195.171.131.2
Pete K

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Posted: 11/04/2019 17:20:46
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Thanks Alex, I appreciate that.

--

Not seen the sun for months. Now evolving to see in the dark.
IP: 95.144.11.188
Tamarmole

Joined: 20/05/2009
Location: Tamar Valley

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Posted: 11/04/2019 18:43:32
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Pete K wrote:

In Derbyshire we've been dealing with an increase in break ins to locked mines which is probably linked in some way to increased publicity on social media and is attracting visits from different types of user groups to those who would traditionally visit these sites. As annoying as this is, we feel that it is down to us (DCA) to try to increase awareness of access systems and why sites need to be treated sensitively. There won't be a stop to the YouTube stuff so visits are likely to continue to increase. In that case, we should endeavour to educate 'other' types of user and be mindful of the content we share online.
I'd actually recently wrote something which I'd kind of hoped might start to find it's way into the 'other' circles, which the DCA has kindly published on their website.
https://thedca.org.uk/
We've begun to place small (iPhone size) plaques near some problem entrances directing people to access info and stating that there are reasons the mine has to stay secure from public access.
Feel free to share the link to the DCA site in the comments of any vids or posts you think would benefit to seeing the letter, or at least become aware of the DCAs existence. That is assuming you agree with my words.
Pete


Excellent stuff.
IP: 86.134.159.195
Mr.C

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Joined: 23/03/2008
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Posted: 11/04/2019 19:16:26
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Tamarmole wrote:

Pete K wrote:

In Derbyshire we've been dealing with an increase in break ins to locked mines which is probably linked in some way to increased publicity on social media and is attracting visits from different types of user groups to those who would traditionally visit these sites. As annoying as this is, we feel that it is down to us (DCA) to try to increase awareness of access systems and why sites need to be treated sensitively. There won't be a stop to the YouTube stuff so visits are likely to continue to increase. In that case, we should endeavour to educate 'other' types of user and be mindful of the content we share online.
I'd actually recently wrote something which I'd kind of hoped might start to find it's way into the 'other' circles, which the DCA has kindly published on their website.
https://thedca.org.uk/
We've begun to place small (iPhone size) plaques near some problem entrances directing people to access info and stating that there are reasons the mine has to stay secure from public access.
Feel free to share the link to the DCA site in the comments of any vids or posts you think would benefit to seeing the letter, or at least become aware of the DCAs existence. That is assuming you agree with my words.
Pete


Excellent stuff.

Certainly is. Thumb Up

--

We inhabit an island made of coal, surrounded by a sea full of fish. How can we go wrong.......
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Peter Burgess

Joined: 01/07/2008
Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

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Posted: 11/04/2019 20:03:46
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ttxela wrote:

alex17595 wrote:

I think a large amount of these Youtubers/Social media people are just using it as a persona to get more views and therefore more money from it.
'


I fear they may be disappointed, I believe it's necessary to be a young attractive female recording yourself playing computer games in your pants to make anything more than pin money.

I really really hope you are not speaking from personal experience there, "Alex"!!!
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ttxela

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Posted: 11/04/2019 20:07:04
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Here's a thought....

Great as that letter is, I suspect if people have found their way to the DCA site the battle is already part won and you may well be preaching to the choir to a certain extent.

If its felt that the problem is people finding out about mines through Youtube in a negative way how about having a DCA (or PDMHS, NAMHO, CAL take your pick) Youtube channel with the information in the letter imparted in video form? In time it could build with suitable videos showing exploration in the manner we want to encourage people to undertake it. At least there is more of a sporting chance of the message reaching Youtube viewers if it is imparted through Youtube!

I think a few years back there was an Aditnow Youtube channel wasn't there?

Edit: Just watched part of the video linked in the original post (couldn't be ars*d to watch all 46 minutes!) suspected it might be the 'Exploring With Lighters' outfit.
IP: 86.138.169.211 Edited: 11/04/2019 20:14:48 by ttxela
SimonRL

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Posted: 11/04/2019 20:36:40
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Peter Burgess wrote:

ttxela wrote:

alex17595 wrote:

I think a large amount of these Youtubers/Social media people are just using it as a persona to get more views and therefore more money from it.
'


I fear they may be disappointed, I believe it's necessary to be a young attractive female recording yourself playing computer games in your pants to make anything more than pin money.

I really really hope you are not speaking from personal experience there, "Alex"!!!


A good few years back at a Munich BAUMA I did a quick video of a humungous Liebherr haul truck that has racked up 1.3 million views. No idea why so many people wanted to watch it, and it's never made me a penny Laugh

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my orders are to sit here and watch the world go by
IP: 62.159.206.3 Edited: 11/04/2019 20:37:12 by SimonRL
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