Mine exploration, photographs and mining history for mine explorers, industrial archaeologists, researchers and historians Mine explorer and mining history videos on YouTube Connect with other mine explorers on Facebook
Tip: do not include 'mine' or 'quarry', search by name e.g. 'cwmorthin', use 'Sounds like search' if unsure of spelling

Advanced Search
'Sounds like search'
Quick a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search

Mine Exploration Forum

This topic is locked, no replies can be added.
Jump to page << < 1 2 3 4 5 6 > >>
Author More Browns Folly mayhem
sinker

Avatar of sinker

Joined: 13/12/2010
Location: North Wales.

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 18:30:45
royfellows wrote:



Your last paragraph appears to my perception to echo what I have been advising, just stay away.



I know NOTHING about this situation so am in no position to comment really....but...."stay away"? When there has been talk of retribution, firearms, a man pushed into a corner?? Sounds to me as if you would just be turning a blind eye and abandoning someone to their fate? I accept that I DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWER but surely someone must have a better solution than that?? Unless, as I suspect, there is more to this than meets the eye....in which case I suggest that we just lock and delete the thread and leave it to those who DO know the full story.....

That's the end of my involvement.

--

Ah, well, now, you see.... IP: 86.128.27.151
Morlock

Avatar of Morlock

Joined: 31/07/2008

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 18:47:06
"firearms", did I miss something in the midst of all this writing? IP: 86.186.138.34
Wormster

Avatar of Wormster

Joined: 15/08/2006
Location: Top of the Mendip Hills

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 18:52:59
royfellows wrote:



Your last paragraph appears to my perception to echo what I have been advising, just stay away.



Indeed Roy! - that have done until now, and, is what I intend to do for the foreseeable future.

sinker wrote:



I know NOTHING about this situation so am in no position to comment really....but...."stay away"? When there has been talk of retribution, firearms, a man pushed into a corner?? Sounds to me as if you would just be turning a blind eye and abandoning someone to their fate? I accept that I DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWER but surely someone must have a better solution than that?? Unless, as I suspect, there is more to this than meets the eye....in which case I suggest that we just lock and delete the thread and leave it to those who DO know the full story.....

That's the end of my involvement.


Ok, I take you first point about non involvement. Retribution and firearms are strong words to bandy about in public and are your words not mine, I did not realise that it had got to that. Yes a man pushed into a corner, I would not abandon the man, nor do I see it fit for me to intervene, but like you I don't have an answer, as (IMO) it must come from the man himself to speak out, as to an outcome.......well who knows?

I'm done.

--

Better to regret something you have done - than to regret something you have not done.
IP: 86.184.162.154
sinker

Avatar of sinker

Joined: 13/12/2010
Location: North Wales.

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 18:57:03
Wormster wrote:



Ok, I take you first point about non involvement. Retribution and firearms are strong words to bandy about in public and are your words not mine, I did not realise that it had got to that. Yes a man pushed into a corner....

I'm done.


To clarify, that was mentioned, but on another website. Pinch of salt...? Who knows? Not me.... but it's "out there" and shouldn't be ignored....

I'm done too....

--

Ah, well, now, you see.... IP: 86.128.27.151
Wormster

Avatar of Wormster

Joined: 15/08/2006
Location: Top of the Mendip Hills

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 18:57:15
royfellows wrote:


Only thing I would add, if you don't mind, is that Brian has upset people who are reasonable mine explorers and historians because they consider his methodology over the top in altering the fabric of the mine.


Very true again Roy, something I was remiss in mentioning in my original post!

--

Better to regret something you have done - than to regret something you have not done.
IP: 86.184.162.154
royfellows

Avatar of royfellows

Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:17:25
I do have to make the point re "a man left to his own fate", when its his own choice to be there.

Something has actually been achieved, the "Brian's Folly" Facebook page has gone. Its one step in the right direction, but the longest journey begins with a single step. Hopefully a step down the ladder of escalation rather than up.


--

"How people get on with these things as a mobile device I cannot begin to imagine, but it certainly explains a lot about peoples behaviour."
IP: 92.23.170.220
Peter Burgess

Joined: 01/07/2008
Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:20:09
Some things are too important for a difference of opinion to determine whether or not you stand by someone who is the subject of hatred and persecution.

--

There isn't enough time!
IP: 31.185.214.239
JohnnearCfon

Avatar of JohnnearCfon

Joined: 22/12/2005
Location: Sir Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:21:05
Wormster wrote:



SNIP

It wasn't that long ago that WE (as a collective) were introduced to Brian and his efforts at BF - WE all thought it was a good thing to do, BUT, then obsessive postings on another forum led to him being banned, with no voice to speak out, then OTHERS (outside of the collective) decided to prey on this unfortunate being, this has escalated to the point that we are confronted with now.





Is Brian banned from this forum? If so, why?

Who are you referring to when you say "the collective" ?
IP: 78.150.138.39
sinker

Avatar of sinker

Joined: 13/12/2010
Location: North Wales.

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:31:09
Peter Burgess wrote:

Some things are too important for a difference of opinion to determine whether or not you stand by someone who is the subject of hatred and persecution.


Yes!

--

Ah, well, now, you see.... IP: 86.128.27.151
SimonRL

Avatar of SimonRL

Joined: 27/11/2005
Location: North Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:44:31
JohnnearCfon wrote:

Is Brian banned from this forum? If so, why?


To the very best of my knowledge he's not even registered on here.

--

my orders are to sit here and watch the world go by
IP: 2.101.173.226 Edited: 21/11/2016 19:45:06 by SimonRL
royfellows

Avatar of royfellows

Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:48:12
Banned from Dark Places.

Can I suggest that we keep the speculation down?

(Nicely)

--

"How people get on with these things as a mobile device I cannot begin to imagine, but it certainly explains a lot about peoples behaviour."
IP: 92.23.170.220
SimonRL

Avatar of SimonRL

Joined: 27/11/2005
Location: North Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:51:28
royfellows wrote:

Banned from Dark Places.

Can I suggest that we keep the speculation down?

(Nicely)


Completely agree Roy re. speculation.

--

my orders are to sit here and watch the world go by
IP: 2.101.173.226
Wormster

Avatar of Wormster

Joined: 15/08/2006
Location: Top of the Mendip Hills

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 19:56:03
JohnnearCfon wrote:

Who are you referring to when you say "the collective" ?


Hmm tricky, but of course I can do it.

I suppose I chose that particular phrase as not to refer to any given side to the situation, but up to now anybody, including myself, who has commented on this or any of the similar threads on the other forums.

--

Better to regret something you have done - than to regret something you have not done.
IP: 86.184.162.154
JohnnearCfon

Avatar of JohnnearCfon

Joined: 22/12/2005
Location: Sir Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 20:20:03
SimonRL wrote:

JohnnearCfon wrote:

Is Brian banned from this forum? If so, why?


To the very best of my knowledge he's not even registered on here.


Sorry Simon, I misinterpreted what was said. Stupid
IP: 78.150.138.39
ttxela

Avatar of ttxela

Joined: 04/09/2007
Location: Cambs

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 21:40:31
sinker wrote:

royfellows wrote:



Your last paragraph appears to my perception to echo what I have been advising, just stay away.



I know NOTHING about this situation so am in no position to comment really....but...."stay away"? When there has been talk of retribution, firearms, a man pushed into a corner?? Sounds to me as if you would just be turning a blind eye and abandoning someone to their fate? I accept that I DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWER but surely someone must have a better solution than that?? Unless, as I suspect, there is more to this than meets the eye....in which case I suggest that we just lock and delete the thread and leave it to those who DO know the full story.....

That's the end of my involvement.


Perhaps there are very few who know the full story, many like myself will know some of the story.

I don't have anything useful to add at this stage beyond what I have already said. However I'd rather the thread wasn't locked and deleted (at least not at this stage) since it seems to me this is a significant issue that mine explorers should be concerned about and this forum is the only one I have some faith in discussion remaining relatively reasoned.



IP: 86.140.163.151
Wormster

Avatar of Wormster

Joined: 15/08/2006
Location: Top of the Mendip Hills

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 21/11/2016 21:59:39
ttxela wrote:

wasn't locked and deleted (at least not at this stage) since it seems to me this is a significant issue that mine explorers should be concerned about and this forum is the only one I have some faith in discussion remaining relatively reasoned.


indeed!

--

Better to regret something you have done - than to regret something you have not done.
IP: 86.184.162.154
The Fresh Prince of Portreath

Joined: 05/08/2015

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 22/11/2016 00:20:00
It's quite clear, all of this fuss is going to result in some sort of backlash. It's the sort of thing that a few of them will sit down and concoct something off the scale.

I'm that sort of person myself, but I keep a lid on it.
IP: 81.140.40.222
Dr J

Joined: 26/09/2006
Location: Bromsgrove

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 22/11/2016 05:08:22
Wading in, sorry..but everything that has happened can be traced back to Brian, you can argue otherwise but it started with him, only with him can it ever end-campaigns of naming and shaming, witch-hunting etc aren't gonna do it, nor is trying to quieten it down..

As Morlock said so perfectly 'the road to hell is paved with good intentions', Brian moved into clear away graffiti, litter, and he was widely supported, the place did need a bit of TLC and hadn't received much attention, so all was good...but he didn't stop.

First well-known and iconic early explorers graffiti e.g. the Eye, stuff in Devils Chamber was removed, self-decision made for miners' stuff only...and then the 'alterations' began. Back wall of Pit Prop Chamber was ripped down (and sorry, but that was a total act of destruction, complete loss of historical context for this area-you can't recognise it anymore as anything but another passage-way), the walls started appearing, everywhere, and then the turning of Clapham Junction, once the absolute highlight of Browns, into a rockery, like some novelty entry for the Chelsea Flower Shower.

No doubt his intentions were pure, by removing all the open space, prevent 'un-welcome' congregating, but *this wasn't his decision to make/execute*, and the spot that had served as lunch for mine explorers for countless years was taken away. Don't think it's coincidence that most of the trouble and 'reclaiming' get togethers have been exactly here. And still the wall-building carried on, wherever-in fact rather than any reasoning for protecting areas of interest, really does seem to be towards whatever his whim of that day, week, month happens to be..to feed his truly bizzare obsession with moving rocks.

Faced with this, concerns mounted, and the likes of DP, 28 Days, much of UK Caving and various other parties started asking, then requesting, ultimately pleading, for the alterations to stop...but to no avail, the only response being incoherent rants (which earned him the ban on DP). Coupled with replacing the official locks on Shakespeares gate, then walling it off from inside (which are reckless, frankly dangerous acts, given this is the best entry point in the event of any underground emergency/rescue), and the following/confronting/stalking of explorers underground, which many, including myself personally have experienced-not enjoyable in the slightest...frankly, he's p£ssed off a lot of people.

So, the bite-back started, first minor acts, pulling down the walls, re-arranging the stones etc..to show displeasure and 'reclaim'..but with no sign of him stopping they escalated and have got more and more extreme. It was inevitable. History demonstrates it time after time; when people are ignored, and others in control, their resistance becomes ever more extreme, and the desperation/anger/resentment grows... Which brings to what has happened now. I don't condone it, at all, such destruction and vandalism that has occurred is heart-breaking, but I do understand it.

Only Brian can stop it, he needs to finally step back, if he wants to continue removing litter fine, to be welcomed, graffiti removing still, ok, to a degree, but no-more damned walls and 'improvements'. Together with returning Clapham Junction to a non-rockery state, this will start to placate things. With the anger and frustration, and high emotions cooled, Browns will no-longer serve as the lightening-rod and catch-point for games, retribution, anarchy, and now general idiots that it has become... In the short-term, there will be more destruction-pulling down of walls etc, but this *is* an abandoned quarry, stonework had collapsed, there was rubble on the floor in places...and most of these walls were never there anyway.

But this won't happen, Brian is never going to take a step back, already I hear he's gone in and blitzed Clapham Junction, putting back those damn rocks, wiping the walls to pristine, and getting everything ready, for it all to happen all over again Glare

--

The road to success is closed for re-surfacing, please follow diversion!
IP: 82.71.36.66
John Mason

Joined: 22/09/2008

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 22/11/2016 05:17:28
And the rest of us mere mortals have Brexit/Trump/climate collapse to deal with! There is some serious navel-gazing going on here..... bored baby-boomers. Thanks! IP: 86.143.139.141
The Fresh Prince of Portreath

Joined: 05/08/2015

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
More Browns Folly mayhem
Posted: 22/11/2016 06:12:14
John Mason wrote:

And the rest of us mere mortals have Brexit/Trump/climate collapse to deal with! There is some serious navel-gazing going on here..... bored baby-boomers. Thanks!


Blair is coming back into politics, so all will be better soon. Perhaps he'll have a duel with that nasty racist Farage!!!

Dr J sums up my thoughts exactly. If he has tidied it up again, what will they do next? Paint the whole place?
IP: 81.140.40.222
Jump to page << < 1 2 3 4 5 6 > >>
Safety LED Miners Caplamps Moore Books: Specialist Books I.A. Recordings: Mining and Industrial History DVDs Starless River - Caving Store Explore a Disused Welsh Slate Mine
Disclaimer: Mine exploring can be quite dangerous, but then again it can be alright, it all depends on the weather. Please read the proper disclaimer.
© 2005 to 2015 AditNow.co.uk
Top of Page