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Author More Browns Folly mayhem
royfellows

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Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Posted: 15/11/2016 14:40:16
Blober wrote:

Having been told a bit more information it really seems the best course of action would be for Brian to just take a step back for the time being. I know many will see that as "giving up" and letting the bullies win, but when they no longer get a rise anymore this will end fairly sharpish and work can be slowly done to rectify any damage and bring it back to how it used to look, no more building of walls and being a super clean swept mine.

I don't think anyone here is trying to be unsupportive, its just a case of what can be feasibly done? Its a long drawn out saga now which doesn't help.


Yes!

This is one of the best pieces of sense on the subject I have seen yet.

Whether one agrees or disagrees with Brians methodology what he is in fact doing is feeding the yobs.

My advice again, keep away, and that to everybody including Brian.

--

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JohnnearCfon

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Posted: 15/11/2016 15:02:58
Whilst I can see your point Roy, I would not give up either. I would see it as "giving in to bullies". I am certainly no "superman", but I would find it very hard to just back off in the way you suggest. That said, I would also find other ways to deal with the problem as well. IP: 92.3.14.156
Morlock

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Posted: 15/11/2016 15:19:13
MonkeyCaver wrote:

The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:


In the case of Browns. I'm surprised that the authorities have not put an end to this stupidity already. It's a time for the headmaster to say "I'm not interested in your story, everyone is banned from the slide" - and then taking it to bits with a JCB.

WTF is wrong with you? And others that think this way too. Is it too much effort to work things out or to unite against the minority? Always go for the close it option so everyone loses out. Well we know that aint gonna happen any time soon. If you dont like what is happening and can not be arsed to give constructive debate then you do not have to read the posts even worse comment on them. We have lost access to too many places as it is. Lets have positive ideas then things may get resolved.


There is nothing wrong with anyone whose views differ from yours, perhaps you need to reconsider your motivation?
Perhaps you could also enlighten us as to why you have lost so much in the area in general?
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royfellows

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Posted: 15/11/2016 15:22:06
JohnnearCfon wrote:

Whilst I can see your point Roy, I would not give up either. I would see it as "giving in to bullies". I am certainly no "superman", but I would find it very hard to just back off in the way you suggest. That said, I would also find other ways to deal with the problem as well.


Yes John, I agree with you.
"I would find it very hard"... All in nutshell
It is very hard, but the sense is there in what both Blobber and I are saying. If there is a solution, that has to be it.

You wont follow this, none of you will, but "loosing to win"

Heavy fall of snow causes branches to bend under the weight of the snow, eventually the snow slides off and the branch returns to its original upright position.
Who won, the snow or the branch?

--

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royfellows

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Posted: 15/11/2016 15:32:25
Morlock wrote:

MonkeyCaver wrote:

The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:


In the case of Browns. I'm surprised that the authorities have not put an end to this stupidity already. It's a time for the headmaster to say "I'm not interested in your story, everyone is banned from the slide" - and then taking it to bits with a JCB.

WTF is wrong with you? And others that think this way too. Is it too much effort to work things out or to unite against the minority? Always go for the close it option so everyone loses out. Well we know that aint gonna happen any time soon. If you dont like what is happening and can not be arsed to give constructive debate then you do not have to read the posts even worse comment on them. We have lost access to too many places as it is. Lets have positive ideas then things may get resolved.


There is nothing wrong with anyone whose views differ from yours, perhaps you need to reconsider your motivation?
Perhaps you could also enlighten us as to why you have lost so much in the area in general?


Relate this to the Zen nonsense in my last

Everyone has a point of view or opinion, even if you disagree you will find at least one small point of their argument with which you broadly agree.

By first conceding this the other will be more prepared to listen to yours and maybe compromise a little.

I try

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Peter Burgess

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Posted: 15/11/2016 15:33:26
Bullying is addictive. Closing the playground where it happens won't stop it happening elsewhere. By which I don't mean another mine. As I think has been mentioned elsewhere, this behaviour is possibly criminal and that is how it should be managed, with that in mind. I would appeal to anyone who has been involved to look inside themselves, and do the right thing to stop this happening, if they have an ounce of humanity.

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There isn't enough time!
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droid

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Posted: 15/11/2016 17:16:24
If the low-lifes perpetrating this are relying on the anonymity of the internet, then possibly the latest posts on UKC might persuade them otherwise. IP: 51.6.41.230
royfellows

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Posted: 15/11/2016 17:37:08
droid wrote:

If the low-lifes perpetrating this are relying on the anonymity of the internet, then possibly the latest posts on UKC might persuade them otherwise.


Big GrinBig GrinBig Grin

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MonkeyCaver

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Posted: 15/11/2016 21:37:39
Morlock wrote:

MonkeyCaver wrote:

The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:


In the case of Browns. I'm surprised that the authorities have not put an end to this stupidity already. It's a time for the headmaster to say "I'm not interested in your story, everyone is banned from the slide" - and then taking it to bits with a JCB.

WTF is wrong with you? And others that think this way too. Is it too much effort to work things out or to unite against the minority? Always go for the close it option so everyone loses out. Well we know that aint gonna happen any time soon. If you dont like what is happening and can not be arsed to give constructive debate then you do not have to read the posts even worse comment on them. We have lost access to too many places as it is. Lets have positive ideas then things may get resolved.


There is nothing wrong with anyone whose views differ from yours, perhaps you need to reconsider your motivation?
Perhaps you could also enlighten us as to why you have lost so much in the area in general?

You are right that was my opinion and I guess I shouted out my minds thoughts, sorry.
I never said in the area. I said 'we have lost access to too many places as it is'. I didnt say they were in the area. It wasnt me or anyone that got them lost but they are being sealed or reworked or various other reasons. We do not need to close more up voluntarily.
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The Fresh Prince of Portreath

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Posted: 16/11/2016 00:43:37
For the record, I have a bit of a reputation for my views on access in the SW. To the point of quite a few people refusing to speak to me.

I'd normally be advocating breaking out the disc cutter or team of men with spades.

However, this really needs to be stopped before a battle shoves it's Jimml Fixit right up the arse of mine exploring.
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MonkeyCaver

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Posted: 16/11/2016 17:56:15
The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:

For the record, I have a bit of a reputation for my views on access in the SW. To the point of quite a few people refusing to speak to me.

I'd normally be advocating breaking out the disc cutter or team of men with spades.

However, this really needs to be stopped before a battle shoves it's Jimml Fixit right up the arse of mine exploring.

I understand. It is good that you and other people are recognising the destruction of the quarry here and the harm caused to many as a result.

I get that we don't all see eye to eye for one reason or another, but that's a part of what makes us human. At least most folk are now able to share an opinion that something has to be done to stop this.

One thing we do all have in common though is that we all have a passion for underground exploration. If we stay focused on that subject I think we should be OK for now.

Simple focused communication will solve much of the problems in the end.

Thank you for your honesty. Honourable people are getting rare!
IP: 82.45.9.4 Edited: 16/11/2016 17:59:23 by MonkeyCaver
droid

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Posted: 16/11/2016 18:22:32
The people doing the damage (and it isn't Brian) are neither honourable, honest nor interested in communication. IP: 51.6.41.230
royfellows

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Posted: 16/11/2016 21:41:12
Yes, and Brian is the injured party. But if he voluntarily removes himself from the equation, that will leave the yobs banging their heads against the wall. They will have nothing.

They party in there, mess everywhere. They go back for another one and they in their own mess. As long as Brian goes in and cleans up afterwards they keep having them.

So in the end, he would actually win.

Then in time when all is quiet.........

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Morlock

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Posted: 16/11/2016 21:52:25
Just about sums it up.Thumb Up IP: 86.180.137.3
MonkeyCaver

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Posted: 16/11/2016 22:06:13
droid wrote:

The people doing the damage (and it isn't Brian) are neither honourable, honest nor interested in communication.

I know Brian well enough to know he is not doing the damage.

I was referring to the decent people of the underground community having honour and communicating, not the trouble makers. We know they have no honour!
IP: 82.45.9.4 Edited: 16/11/2016 22:08:09 by MonkeyCaver
MonkeyCaver

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Posted: 17/11/2016 05:48:31
royfellows wrote:

Yes, and Brian is the injured party. But if he voluntarily removes himself from the equation, that will leave the yobs banging their heads against the wall. They will have nothing.

They party in there, mess everywhere. They go back for another one and they in their own mess. As long as Brian goes in and cleans up afterwards they keep having them.

So in the end, he would actually win.

Then in time when all is quiet.........

You know how we have to 'use it of lose it'? Well this becomes more and more obvious as you age.

Now lets suppose that rather than lose the ability to stay strong and keep active, someone decides that the best thing they can do is continue to do unpaid work knowing that the best benefit they get is actually to their body itself.

Would you give it up?? Particularly if you had a genuine passionate love for the place you 'work' at?
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crickleymal

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Posted: 17/11/2016 06:55:48
OK so what can we (as decent honest folk) do?

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Malc. Rusted and ropey, Dog eared old copy Vintage and classic or just plain Jurassic All words to describe me.
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Peter Burgess

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Posted: 17/11/2016 08:23:34
The idiots want attention. Don't give it to them. Those in the area who care might think about restoring ruined areas to their former condition, quietly, efficiently, and without fuss. Repeat, and repeat. Those who know Brian might think about discussing this with him so he understands what help is being offered. However, as I am not a local, this is merely a thought from an uninvolved observer. Quiet, effective, and non-confrontational.


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Peter Burgess

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Posted: 17/11/2016 10:55:34
I should add the important thing is not to publicise the damage so it gets no oxygen. Just keep on making good. The more that do it, the stronger the "quiet army". It might not keep the site safe, but it would encourage Brian and help him realise people care.

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NouveauRiche

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Posted: 17/11/2016 14:57:06
MonkeyCaver wrote:

The Fresh Prince of Portreath wrote:


In the case of Browns. I'm surprised that the authorities have not put an end to this stupidity already. It's a time for the headmaster to say "I'm not interested in your story, everyone is banned from the slide" - and then taking it to bits with a JCB.

WTF is wrong with you? And others that think this way too. Is it too much effort to work things out or to unite against the minority? Always go for the close it option so everyone loses out. Well we know that aint gonna happen any time soon. If you dont like what is happening and can not be arsed to give constructive debate then you do not have to read the posts even worse comment on them. We have lost access to too many places as it is. Lets have positive ideas then things may get resolved.



Firstly the vandalism is absolutely shocking, and having a look at the "Brian's folly" facebook page linked on the UK caving thread, I've had my fill of losing my faith in the human population for another day.

However, I must also add, that the tone, language and outright name calling and character assassination on that UK caving thread and many others I have read is astoundingly horrifying.... and that's when I reply to what was written above... if you cannot say it nicely and respectfully, do not say it at all. Playground bickering and childish bullying and attacks do not achieve anything.

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