Mine exploration, photographs and mining history for mine explorers, industrial archaeologists, researchers and historians Mine explorer and mining history videos on YouTube Connect with other mine explorers on Facebook
Tip: do not include 'mine' or 'quarry', search by name e.g. 'cwmorthin', use 'Sounds like search' if unsure of spelling

Advanced Search
'Sounds like search'
Quick a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search

Mine Exploration Forum

Jump to page << < 1 2 > >>
Author Port Talbot & Tata
ChrisJC

Avatar of ChrisJC

Joined: 13/10/2007
Location: Northants

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 13:52:21
Reply |  Quote
It seems
[web link]
there's talk of a new mine.

The most talked about possibility is for a deep mine to be built at the Port Talbot works.

A £6m feasibility study is in the process of being carried out.

...

He believes it's a matter of when, not if, the decision is made.

The Margam super pit has been spoken about since the early seventies but no-one has ever tapped into its vast reserves.

If it goes ahead, Tata would be looking to mine 1m tonnes of coal a year. That is about half the amount that Port Talbot requires and in terms of tonnage would make it the biggest pit ever to have been built in south Wales.


Sounds exciting if it goes ahead!

Chris.
IP: 90.152.39.96
derrickman

Avatar of derrickman

Joined: 18/02/2009

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 20:36:40
Reply |  Quote
I'm afraid I would be wholly unconvinced by anything said by Tata.

This would be the same Tata who closed a steelworks recently for a carbon credits scam, and repeatedly threatened the government with closing Land Rover unless government loans were made available at what amounted to an open line of rolling credit

Note also comments about foreign ( ie Polish ) labour. There are still plenty of miners in Wales, we proved that at Combe Down. That will change in the foreseeable future, but for now there is no real problem getting experienced miners.

Remember there are now more Polish than Welsh speakers in Ebbw Vale... I would also doubt that any UK contractor would still have the resources to carry out the work

IP: 86.30.241.199 Edited: 27/09/2010 20:39:15 by derrickman
christwigg

Avatar of christwigg

Joined: 20/02/2008
Location: Cleveland / North Yorkshire

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 20:52:24
Reply |  Quote
I work for them and i'm equally spectical, but I don't think theres any mileage in the 'carbon credits scam' theory.

It got mothballed because the consortium that took 80% of the steel broke their ten year contract.

But hopefully some nice chaps from Korea are going to turn it back on again.
IP: 82.5.179.238 Edited: 27/09/2010 20:55:06 by christwigg
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 22:17:07
Reply |  Quote
derrickman wrote:





Note also comments about foreign ( ie Polish ) labour. There are still plenty of miners in Wales, we proved that at Combe Down. That will change in the foreseeable future, but for now there is no real problem getting experienced miners.

But what was the average age of them,?a lot got employment at Unity and Aberpergwm
,and now with the new investment at Pergwm,they are struggling to find Experienced miners.

My butty and myself have been struggling to find a Fireman-Deputy,who would be interested in an equal share option of re-opening a private mine,with 18yrs coal left,with a section of 5ft,of Dry Steam Coal,

Anyone know the phone number of the Kracaw Gassette?


IP: 81.156.13.179
ChrisJC

Avatar of ChrisJC

Joined: 13/10/2007
Location: Northants

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 22:21:09
Reply |  Quote
I would think the comments about foreign labour are because the local workforce would rather take the dole than work in a dirty coal mine.
We have a strawberry farm in the village, which is not far from Peterborough. There are nearly 200 Eastern European fruit pickers during the summer. Yet there are more than 200 unemployed in Peterborough.........

Chris.
IP: 86.142.211.55
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 27/09/2010 23:31:14
Reply |  Quote
ChrisJC wrote:

I would think the comments about foreign labour are because the local workforce would rather take the dole than work in a dirty coal mine.
We have a strawberry farm in the village, which is not far from Peterborough. There are nearly 200 Eastern European fruit pickers during the summer. Yet there are more than 200 unemployed in Peterborough.........

Chris.


A big difference underground working to picking fruit,HSE,training etc,but take your point,thats the main reason Eastern Europeans are here,because there are so many in the UK better off on benifits,
I wonder if that will change with this Government,as there has been plenty of talk for years,but no action to the problem.
IP: 81.156.13.179
jagman

Joined: 11/03/2007

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 07:59:40
Reply |  Quote
Ty Gwyn wrote:

ChrisJC wrote:

I would think the comments about foreign labour are because the local workforce would rather take the dole than work in a dirty coal mine.
We have a strawberry farm in the village, which is not far from Peterborough. There are nearly 200 Eastern European fruit pickers during the summer. Yet there are more than 200 unemployed in Peterborough.........

Chris.



A big difference underground working to picking fruit,HSE,training etc,but take your point,thats the main reason Eastern Europeans are here,because there are so many in the UK better off on benifits,
I wonder if that will change with this Government,as there has been plenty of talk for years,but no action to the problem.


We have 2.5 million unemployed.
We have 3 million imported un or low skilled workers
The maths aren't difficult and the career dole skivers will work when they get hungry enough.
IP: 90.207.149.57
christwigg

Avatar of christwigg

Joined: 20/02/2008
Location: Cleveland / North Yorkshire

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 08:05:39
Reply |  Quote
jagman wrote:


The maths aren't difficult and the career dole skivers will work when they get hungry enough.


Or more likely go on the rob.
IP: 82.5.179.238
Roger the Cat

Avatar of Roger the Cat

Joined: 12/11/2007
Location: Gloucestershire

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 09:33:05
Reply |  Quote
christwigg wrote:

jagman wrote:


The maths aren't difficult and the career dole skivers will work when they get hungry enough.


Or more likely go on the rob.


Thats enough chaps.

Just have the good grace to accept that you have jobs and that many able, hard-working people at present do not.

Mediator - maybe it's time to pull the plug on this thread - not good for my blood pressure!
IP: 79.67.53.232
SimonRL

Avatar of SimonRL

Joined: 27/11/2005
Location: North Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 09:53:48
Reply |  Quote
Nothing wrong with this thread. Just some people giving their opinions. And it started with a report of a potential 1m tonne a year coal mining development so I can't see it getting pulled... IP: 95.148.11.76
ChrisJC

Avatar of ChrisJC

Joined: 13/10/2007
Location: Northants

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 10:09:15
Reply |  Quote
Personally I would take some political action to use the opportunity (if it ever happens!) to employ local people over migrant workers. I dare say there's an EU directive preventing it, but I would:
1. Only allow migrants when employment in the local area was zero
2. Compel the unemployed to take employment at t'pit.

And to boot, we get a super-duper new deep coal mine that we can have trips to visit!

Chris.
IP: 90.152.39.96
Peter Burgess

Joined: 01/07/2008
Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 10:26:22
Reply |  Quote
Well, if it isn't going to be pulled, here's my thinking.

1) I loathe the awful generalisations that are resorted to when some people make scathing comments about people on benefits, or who are unemployed for whatever reason.

2) I don't like the underlying and unwritten suggestion that those who come here from abroad are "stealing" work from the British. They are not. See 3).

3) The booming UK soft fruit market would never have taken off without the availability of migrant labour. 100 years ago it was travellers (gypsies?) and internal migrants who did this. Now it's migrants from other countries. It's called globalisation, and in the current world it cannot be ignored.

4) A migrant agricultural worker's costs are low. They generally live in temporary accommodation, send money home to a country where costs are generally lower, and work all the hours they can to earn enough to make it worth their while being here. A local worker is most likely going to have much higher living costs, even just to keep a roof over the heads of their family. I am sure there are a lot who shun the idea of taking up temporary work just because it is hard work for little pay, but I guess there are also lots who just simply cannot afford to come off benefits to this end. I am sure I am over-simplifying things, but without further evidence this is how I see it. Most people are much the same in outlook and expectations. Some are luckier than others, but we are all just humans with an instinct to do the best for ourselves and our families.

5) Regarding employing local miners, as time moves on, there are fewer and fewer trained young miners in the UK. Little wonder that there is talk of bringing them from elsewhere - no training required, and they can hit the road running. It's a no brainer for any big business to look for the most available workforce and be less bothered about local-ism.

--

Hé ! Ki kapcsolva le a villanyt ?
IP: 81.144.191.248
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 10:31:26
Reply |  Quote
simonrl wrote:

Nothing wrong with this thread. Just some people giving their opinions. And it started with a report of a potential 1m tonne a year coal mining development so I can't see it getting pulled...


This 1 million ton output has been banded about ,not long ago with Unity,i believe Oakdale comlex achieved this once,but with over a 1,000 men,and far better conditions to what are going to be found at Margam

The area is one big disturb,seams pitching on thier head,major water problems,which finished off Newlands,only a stones throw away,and by past borings,full of Gas,

I would think half that production would be pushing it.
IP: 86.142.190.172
SimonRL

Avatar of SimonRL

Joined: 27/11/2005
Location: North Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 10:34:10
Reply |  Quote
Nothing wrong with a bit of debate. Nobody has said anything untoward, both sides can have their say and nobody is taking a pop at anybody else!

I can't delete every thread on here Laugh

Brining it back to the original post, a coal mining development in S Wales would be very exciting indeed.
IP: 95.148.11.76 Edited: 28/09/2010 10:36:33 by SimonRL
ChrisJC

Avatar of ChrisJC

Joined: 13/10/2007
Location: Northants

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 10:44:16
Reply |  Quote
So is there any on-line documentation describing the geology of the proposed pit? It sounds like a nightmare. We hear about 'geological problems' terminating mines quite often....

Peter - the problem with your approach is that it is no good for the country long-term. Exporting money (which is what it amounts to) just leaves us poorer, and exporting skills leaves us impoverished.

Chris.
IP: 90.152.39.96
Peter Burgess

Joined: 01/07/2008
Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 11:15:21
Reply |  Quote
Would you prefer to have no low-labour cost industry then? Because if we didn't grow the soft fruit here, it would be grown somewhere else. The profits from the trade are taxed so there is some benefit in keeping it. Or shall we turf all the potential local workers out of their homes into caravans so they can afford to do the work instead, and earn enough to eat? Yes, I undertand it is a problem, but the solution is never going to be simple. As for miners, my comments on age / training still stand.

--

Hé ! Ki kapcsolva le a villanyt ?
IP: 81.144.191.248
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 11:40:13
Reply |  Quote
ChrisJC wrote:

So is there any on-line documentation describing the geology of the proposed pit? It sounds like a nightmare. We hear about 'geological problems' terminating mines quite often....

Peter - the problem with your approach is that it is no good for the country long-term. Exporting money (which is what it amounts to) just leaves us poorer, and exporting skills leaves us impoverished.

Chris.


Check out the Margam posts on the Welshcoalmines site,there a lot of info there on the proposed mine,also neighbouring mines,and thier problems.


Peters point about age and trained Men is a very valid point,you`d be lucky to find a trained Miner under the age of 48yrs,they stopped training about 25 yrs ago,when Maggie shut the mines,British coal and Private indirectly.
IP: 86.142.190.172
Peter Burgess

Joined: 01/07/2008
Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 12:04:56
Reply |  Quote
It's worth remembering that this wouldn't be the first time that miners from Poland came to Britain to work in the mines. Were there not a significant number of Poles in Cornwall?

--

Hé ! Ki kapcsolva le a villanyt ?
IP: 81.144.191.248
SimonRL

Avatar of SimonRL

Joined: 27/11/2005
Location: North Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 12:07:19
Reply |  Quote
And Germans in the Lakes I believe [web link] IP: 95.148.11.76
ChrisJC

Avatar of ChrisJC

Joined: 13/10/2007
Location: Northants

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Port Talbot & Tata
Posted: 28/09/2010 13:08:09
Reply |  Quote
simonrl wrote:

And Germans in the Lakes I believe [web link]


I think there's a difference, in that the German miners in the Lakes were 'High Tech' for the day, and brought with them the latest in mining technology.

I am presuming (perhaps wrongly) that we already have access to state of the art coal mining techniques in South Wales, and the import of foreign labour is simply because they are cheap navvies.

Chris.
IP: 90.152.39.96
Jump to page << < 1 2 > >>
Safety LED Miners Caplamps Moore Books: Specialist Books I.A. Recordings: Mining and Industrial History DVDs Starless River - Caving Store Explore a Disused Welsh Slate Mine
Disclaimer: Mine exploring can be quite dangerous, but then again it can be alright, it all depends on the weather. Please read the proper disclaimer.
© 2005 to 2015 AditNow.co.uk
Top of Page