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Author Snailbeach Railway
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 03/09/2010 10:32:22
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Tamarmole wrote:

As I say it all struck me as odd.

They restored a WW1 War Departmet Baldwin at great expense in a works they had set up in the far east, imported it into the uk where no one saw it, sold it and then promptly dropped dead.

I do wonder if it is all just an elaborate hoax.


my reading of the published material regarding the Baldwin, is that it was owned and restored by a third party unconnected with the scheme. The locomotive itself certainly exists, but any connection between the original owner and restorer, the subsequent purchaser and anyone at Smailbeach remains open to verification, at the very least.

I've seen the letter from the son referred to in the last post, probably on the same website. Quite what to make of it, I have no idea.

The SO2 website makes certain claims about cashflow, which would appear to be verifiable at Companies House by anyone with sufficient interest.

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kscanes

Joined: 04/09/2010

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 04/09/2010 07:57:02
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derrickman wrote:

...The locomotive itself certainly exists ...


Can you give any further details? I'm afraid I had concluded it was a figment of a school boy's imagination, but I'd be very happy to be proved wrong.

Ken Scanes
IP: 188.65.183.52
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 04/09/2010 08:57:46
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join the SO2 yahoo group and read for yourself, and draw your own conclusions.

there are various mentions of the loco, scattered about the web. A number of such locos appear to have come to the ends of their useful lives around that time and been sold on to people who would spend the money to restore them, while they were still saleable.

We are now arriving at the point where there are very few remaining unrestored examples of locos from this period in viable condition, and the few specimens are being offered at huge prices; see correspondence in various places regarding the remains of ex-WD Hudson 4-6-0s in Nepal, for example.

There doesn't seem to be any real evidence that it was ever connected to the Snailbeach project in any way.

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JohnnearCfon

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 04/09/2010 19:38:52
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I think you will find Ken Scanes is already on that group and has been for a while! IP: 78.150.240.17
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 04/09/2010 20:43:15
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from personal contacts in Oz, it has been suggested that this is the locomotive in question [web link]

it was extensively rebuilt for use on a theme park railway in the late 1970s and has been professionally maintained ever since; it is still in full operational order

it is believed to be the only operational Baldwin 4-6-0 in the Southern Hemisphere

there is also a fully operational 0-4-2ST in Oz
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JohnnearCfon

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Posted: 04/09/2010 20:45:41
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Yuk! is all I can say to that! IP: 78.150.240.17
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 04:08:51
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I would say, it is a working example of a rare historic locomotive doing the job it was designed for!

I can't say I much approve of the overall appearance either, but I'm a great believer in seeing things like that working rather than 'stuffed and mounted' as they so often are.

So, full marks for preserving a piece of working history, sez I



by way of comparison, look at the 19th and early 20th century photographs of Whitby Abbey. Compare the modern 'manicured' appearance with the 'romantic ruin' appearance to be found there until the 1950s, with cattle grazing in the nave and narrow footpaths winding between fallen blocks of masonry.

Whitby Abbey is a particular example, because it was extensively photographed, but it is a typical example. Tintern also comes to mind.

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kscanes

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 05:08:13
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derrickman wrote:

from personal contacts in Oz, it has been suggested that this is the locomotive in question [web link]

it was extensively rebuilt for use on a theme park railway in the late 1970s and has been professionally maintained ever since; it is still in full operational order

it is believed to be the only operational Baldwin 4-6-0 in the Southern Hemisphere


With respect, if has been down south since 1970, it can't be the one that Wayne & Co (i.e. the Snailbeach Railway fantasists) supposedly brought to the UK!

--

Ken Scanes
IP: 188.65.183.52
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 06:12:49
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my reading of the published material, and I have no other source of information, is that the Snailbeach 'group' ( for want of a better description ) claimed to be purchasing this locomotive at a time when it was in SE Asia receiving a major overhaul, related to its ongoing use in the theme park.

I have never seen any actual claim that they brought it to the UK, although I may have simply missed this. It is stated in some sources that the loco was restored and sold to a third party, by my Australian contact informs me that it was simply refurbished and returned to its owners at the theme park for further duty.

I wonder if there is some further confusion with the Baldwins imported from India. If I understand matters
correctly, two Baldwin 4-6-0s were imported over a period of time from Indian sugar cane lines; these were initially identified by the nnames 'Lion' and 'Tiger' but have subsequently morphed into the locos now to be seen at the WHR and LBLR under the numbers 778 and 590, although I could be wrong.

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JohnnearCfon

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 11:55:56
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I was referring to the current appearence the theme park makeover had given it, not the fact it was working! I agree with you, far better to see a loco working rather than stuffed and mounted in a pristine condtion that is totally out of character. IP: 78.150.247.157
kscanes

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 12:12:28
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derrickman wrote:

I have never seen any actual claim that they brought it [the Baldwin] to the UK, although I may have simply missed this.


This was on the National Preservation discussion group, we had regular updates from Wayne. It's left Asia, it's en route, it's arrived in the UK, it's been whisked away to private storage, no, no one can see it, no there are no photographs of it. It was about this time that one or two people began to doubt the veracity of the scheme; up until then it all seemed plausible and quite exiting.

The discussion on Nat Pres was removed following threats by Wayne to sue for libel the owner of the discussion group, the posters on the discussion group, and anybody else who happened to be passing at the time. With hindsight it is doubtful if the threat was realistic, but I cannot criticise the owner of the discussion group for thinking, "I don't need this agro", removing the thread and banning any mention of the word Snailbeach.

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Ken Scanes
IP: 188.65.183.52
derrickman

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Snailbeach Railway
Posted: 05/09/2010 12:23:59
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ok fair enough, I'm not on the Nat Pres forum so I missed that little gem.

suffice to say that from my contacts in Oz, the only Baldwin 4-6-0 known to have been rebuilt in the SoPac region recent years, is that one.


There is a little 0-4-2ST in Oz, restored in recent years, which is a nice little thing but outside the present scope
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