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Mine Exploration Forum

Author Bat Pillars / Entrances
Dolcoathguy

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Joined: 21/05/2008
Location: Camborne, Cornwall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 07:50:41
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I have noticed that in Kerrier the Bat Pillars on capped shafts are surrounded by a small circle of large stone chips (1 - 2 inch) in size. Local Children seem to be placing these chips/stones in the 2 inch holes, meaning the entrances are blocked. Surely a design fault? Other than the "Climbing frame" cone above an open shaft are there any other better designs for Bat entrances?
Why is there a need to surround them with stone chips?
IP: 194.126.226.253
Cornish Pixie

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Joined: 02/01/2009
Location: Wicklow, Ireland

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 10:46:57
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Beam me up Scotty, there's no intelligent life at Kerrier!!! You couldn't make it up could you? Oh My God

--

Den heb davaz a gollaz i dir
IP: 62.40.57.229
spitfire

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Joined: 22/04/2008
Location: Camborne

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 15:46:44
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I think when taking people around the mines in Kerrier district,
instead of mentioning names like Loam,Woolf, Trevithick and so on another would be more appropriate: WALT' DISNEY

--

spitfire
IP: 81.141.104.245 Edited: 07/04/2009 16:20:43 by spitfire
Morlock

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Joined: 31/07/2008

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 16:07:35
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Dolcoathguy wrote:

are there any other better designs for Bat entrances?


Yep, 24 inch pipe. Laugh
IP: 86.27.179.26
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 20:14:50
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This is how its done when its not someone elses money

Frongoch adit shaft, capped by RF/WMS 2002



EDIT
It cost me about £250, a few bruises and a sore back. If it had been a council job there would of course been £20,000 in consultants fees.

--

'There's a lot of activity for a disused mine!' - Bond in 'A view to a kill'
IP: 78.149.40.92 Edited: 07/04/2009 20:19:52 by royfellows
stuey

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Joined: 15/08/2007

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 07/04/2009 23:27:29
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What you are talking about are Kerrier style shaft "plugs".

In the past, I have also been guilty of pushing stones into the holes to see if they "go". I've come to the rude conclusion that I overlooked the most obvious point of the holes. To put a bar through! What you are looking at are the holes which a rod was threaded through and then slung from a JCB to put the marker in place.

These mark plugged shafts, large engine shafts and ones which were also open to the same workings were treated differently, usually with a big spangly bat castle. As far as I can tell there are several distinct capping styles which you come across.

1. "Minecap" Clwyd cones (mesh cones) with rubble inside. A cone was chucked in the shaft upside down and boulders slung in, then a layer of concrete (varies) and then a "right way up cone" and then rubble to cover. These are all over the place and sometimes the stuff underneath has dropped (as in consols) and has left a big hole under the grille. I gather some of these were actually done without the undertreatment.

2. Carnon batcastle jobbies. Built of breezeblocks with re-bar castles, often on high turrets of blocks. Very nice jobs. A proper girders/collar job. Some on Creegbrawse and one down by Tywarnhayle. These predated the later Carnon jobbies. Also available as laddered shafts for 80's exploration jobbies. (can't say where!). These are often covered with foot scraper style grilles.

3. Later Carnon jobbies. Plugs with the markers you talk about and then largely surface girders in the style of a lid with a rectangle approx 4m^2x2.5m turret with very heavy duty steel bar windows. See Wheal Prosper, Tresavean, Gorland for examples. Plugs are made on an allmighty scale and shafts treated in this way will never see light of day again. Sadly, loads were done in this manner in the early 90's.

4. Stonework "box" with vent. Gorland/Unity/Tresavean. Back in the day when mines closed, I gather that they often left a vent tube to the top of a shaft as a marker and enclosed this around a turret of cheesy stonework. I think these were done with the view to being opened in the future and may be diggable through.

5. Occasionally, you get the odd concrete "lid" which are quite rare and would be easy, if a very bad idea to get through. See W Peevor, Williams Dolcoath, etc.

Remember folks, messing with cages is a hazard and can constitute criminal damage.



IP: 212.139.96.209 Edited: 07/04/2009 23:35:32 by stuey
Roy Morton

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Joined: 09/10/2007
Location: Redruth Cornwall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 08/04/2009 00:34:29
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stuey wrote:


Remember folks, messing with cages is a hazard and can constitute criminal damage.


IMHO, messing with the county's heritage should also constitute criminal damage.

There would be many for the block if it was so.
For instance; the latest fiasco report from Robinson's is that they have demolished the miners dry and are going to replace it with.........a pond. When I asked if this would be an Engine Pond I was told ..'No' ...'Ornamental'
The man telling me this has nothing to do with the project but does have high standing in the Cornish mining heritage world.
His cynicism was obvious, for when I suggested ....Goldfish? he anwered 'Beer cans probably'
Once again, when it comes to doing something for Cornwall they choose people who haven't a clue about the subject, and do very little original research. Rather than portray the reality of mining, they appear intent on including features that are wholly misplaced. Ornamental Pond......!? ...much better than a grotty smelly miners dry; Filth, muck, death....Can't have any of that, it would clash with the gingham curtains.
I understand that the long established and well respected Carn Brea Mining Society, had offered their input to the project. Result?.......No interest whatsoever. Probably because Heartlands (sounds like the South African Homelands) can't charge it to their,IMHO, already inflated cost projections.
Advice costs nothing, and there are professional people among us that would be quite willing to offer ideas and advice before any plans are finalised.

Looks like SNAFU again....!









--

'Bid me discourse, I will enchant thine ear'
IP: 81.153.210.132 Edited: 08/04/2009 01:55:44 by Roy Morton
carnkie

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Joined: 07/09/2007
Location: camborne, cornwall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 08/04/2009 01:18:54
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Just to add another dimension.
[web link]
Very fine site if you like bats. I do.


--

The past is a foreign country: they do things differently there.
IP: 79.74.200.86 Edited: 08/04/2009 01:26:21 by carnkie
Dolcoathguy

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Joined: 21/05/2008
Location: Camborne, Cornwall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 08/04/2009 07:46:10
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Stuey
Holes I refer to are on pebble dashed c.3ft pillars which seem to have several holes in them (how many rods were needed for installation?). The ones that are blocked I have found around Dolcoath. The same design is found without a stone chip surround in the middle of some stonewall collared capped shafts, which makes me think it is for bats, becuase no one can read what is on the pillar unless they climb the wall. The walls have on information plaque on them anyway.
But any hole is going to attract stones as we all like to hear the sound of stones sploshing as it hits the bottom of the shaft. I thought the wise thing to do would be to surround stones much smaller than the hole or much bigger (better).
Thanks for all the info. My wife works with some Bat surveyors at the Wildlife trust so will see what they think.
Some other caps (see Dunkin garden shaft in Dolcoath photos) are just simple stone clad pillars with no holes and just a plaque. I know Bat surveyors checked out some of these shafts with the bat cam / sled before capping / re capping, which may explain why some have bat access.
Thanks again most informative.
IP: 194.126.226.253 Edited: 08/04/2009 07:52:16 by Dolcoathguy
stuey

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 08/04/2009 08:59:42
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Interesting stuff.

I forgot about the designs around Camborne which appear to be a short chimney with a hole for bats down the middle. As I haven't really poked around Camborne that much, I haven't really had a look at them.

The plugged ones followed this roughish spec (I recall ish). 2m below solid rock, flare the shaft slightly and put in steels, fill 3x depth of the shortest shaft dimension with C30.

In short, it would probably be easier to sink another shaft past the "cork".

As one of the chaps who did the plugging said, "the council had money to throw around and we plugged some beauties".

It's very much my view that the underground workings are of as much historical significance as the above ground stuff.

I'm sure a lot of the plugged ones were either choked or went straight to water (as they were simultaneously bat castling shafts).

Edit:- On the subject of Robinson's, I drive past expecting the headgear to be gone. I was at the site of Wheal Droskyn engine shaft a few days ago and noted the gaudy stainless sundial placed there. Words cannot describe the vitriol I have for these idiots.

Anyway, happy-happy Cursing
IP: 88.109.201.98 Edited: 08/04/2009 09:06:45 by stuey
agricola

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Joined: 28/10/2007
Location: In a book

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 13/04/2009 17:33:44
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On a different slant, I thought you would like to know that Robinson's Dry - the horrible building next to the engine house, has apparently been demolished. Why, so that a new dry can be constructed as the old one was not suitable.

Why its a dry and what miners changed in... Cursing Perhaps it was not the sort of heritage that was required. Wink
IP: 91.108.101.194
Tezarchaeon

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Joined: 14/08/2008

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 13/04/2009 17:46:56
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It should be a mandatory requirement that after visiting the site and taking the 'guided' (e.g. sod all clue) tour all tourists visiting the newly constructed 'dry' should be made to roll in filth, get soaked in freezing water, walk accross the yard, strip naked infront of everyone else, play lucky dip with the soap bucket (soap or faeces... everyone is a winner!), shower off, get dressed and ****** off home. Oh and have a look at the crappy windmill on your way out... IP: 90.240.148.100
carnkie

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Joined: 07/09/2007
Location: camborne, cornwall

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Bat Pillars / Entrances
Posted: 13/04/2009 18:04:20
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agricola wrote:

On a different slant, I thought you would like to know that Robinson's Dry - the horrible building next to the engine house, has apparently been demolished. Why, so that a new dry can be constructed as the old one was not suitable.

Why its a dry and what miners changed in... Cursing Perhaps it was not the sort of heritage that was required. Wink


As I'm sure you know the former miners dry for Bickfords and Palmers Shafts ( I hope that's correct) is now a grade 11 listed building after the revamp. I rather like the sign,"Cornwall Enterprise". Are they extracting the urine?


(click image to open full size image in new window)

--

The past is a foreign country: they do things differently there.
IP: 79.74.240.246 Edited: 13/04/2009 18:28:30 by carnkie
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