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Author Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
rufenig

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Joined: 18/03/2008
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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 08:26:33
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Quoted from other site
Thanks for your kind comments guys. I would note that another mine in the area has just had a 100 grand trampoline installed and it seems to be enjoying a fair bit of local support. I'm not saying anything on the subject.

The chopping of the gate has certainly been done maliciously and almost certainly with a vehicle to carry the heavy gear required. There are suspicions to the culprit of this act but I won't go into it here.

The gate will be fixed on Saturday by a welding team who will put it back to normal. Hopefully it'll get left alone for a while a new one is designed that will be impregnable.
IP: 80.189.223.228 Edited: 04/07/2014 08:27:56 by rufenig
Peter Burgess

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Location: Merstham. Or is it Godstone ...... ?

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 08:36:02
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Isn't the internet a wonderful place? Now I know the most convenient tool to buy should I ever need to cut metal in a remote place. But I imagine anyone intent on doing this would work it out anyway. But no harm in making sure we know. Thumb Down

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SimonRL

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 09:15:49
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Peter Burgess wrote:

Isn't the internet a wonderful place? Now I know the most convenient tool to buy should I ever need to cut metal in a remote place. But I imagine anyone intent on doing this would work it out anyway. But no harm in making sure we know. Thumb Down


The type of person with the intent to cause malicious damage like that would know. Either because they'd typed "portable angle grinder" into Google or because they'd nipped into their local tool shop.
IP: 95.148.15.51 Edited: 04/07/2014 09:17:32 by SimonRL
DylanW

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 10:36:05
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This reminds me of a similar scenario we had in Maenofferen a good few years ago, i cant remember the actual sum, but a significant amount of money was spent on replacing locks & chains to secure the mine adit and buildings over one year, only for them to be repeatedly broken and vandalised. I remember us also blocking the adit entrance with slate waste- only to find that someone/ gang cleared just enough of it to gain entrance.
So unfortunatly it's not a new thing, and the trouble some people will go to gain access is incredible, especialy if they have their mind set on it.
PS, i noticed someone trying to link the coverage of "bounce below' in Llechwedd to this vandalism in Cwmorthin. The angle some people go to give Llechwedd/Greaves a good old bashing never fails to suprise me. As Quarry Tours has been open for decades, i somehow doubt that this is a contrubuiting factor, as if i recall from recent posts on this site, this is the third or forth time this year that the gate/lock has been broken...

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A sibrydodd yn welw ei wedd, rhowch garrag las ar fy medd, o chwaral y Penrhyn, lle' r euthym yn blentyn i'r gwaith.
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sinker

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 10:49:37
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DylanW wrote:



.....i noticed someone trying to link the coverage of "bounce below' in Llechwedd to this vandalism in Cwmorthin. The angle some people go to give Llechwedd/Greaves a good old bashing.....



Woops, but I don't think that anyone was suggesting a direct link as such? Just the suggestion that people who had been to Bounce Below may develop an interest in underground exploration and may go researching abandoned mines in the vicinity and may end up visiting Cwmorthin. Probably on a GoBelow tour? No Greaves-bashing intended, I'm sure....?

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rufenig

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 11:53:05
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Well I am disapointed! Cursing
Over 40 posts and no one has yet blamed
Urban explorers,
Mineral collectors
or 28 d---!Laugh

What is the world coming to!Oh My God
I do believe that it is wrong to name certain local attractions in accusations

But I AM convinced in my own mind that it is some sort of local issue.
IP: 80.189.223.228 Edited: 04/07/2014 12:27:37 by rufenig
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 12:13:55
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DylanW wrote:

This reminds me of a similar scenario we had in Maenofferen a good few years ago, i cant remember the actual sum, but a significant amount of money was spent on replacing locks & chains to secure the mine adit and buildings over one year, only for them to be repeatedly broken and vandalised. I remember us also blocking the adit entrance with slate waste- only to find that someone/ gang cleared just enough of it to gain entrance.


I rather suspect that the thieving of copper cable could be part of the equation there.

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dwarrowdelf

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Joined: 09/02/2011
Location: Lost in Cwmorthin...and Oakeley too !!

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 14:54:28
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Coming a bit late to this topic as have been busy.

Don't wish to get embroiled in any speculations, issues etc as I know little or nothing of the back ground to this situation, beyond the fact that it's happened before.

All I can say is that I'm very dismayed to see that it has happened yet again.


I hope the situation is resolved soon, and we can all go back to simply enjoying Cwmorthin.




--

'I wonder how many breakfasts, and other meals we have missed inside that nasty clockless, timeless hole?' 'The Hobbit' J R R Tolkien.
IP: 46.64.185.34 Edited: 04/07/2014 15:07:24 by dwarrowdelf
royfellows

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 15:28:20
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I think that past incidents and the current one are down to different parties. In the last incident bar this one the lock was cut off and a bag of rubish appeared inside the entrance. I personally put this down to ravers who at least had the decency to clear the rubish together at the end.
The current incident is someone, or more likely some people, trying to make a statement.

--

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DylanW

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 22:12:40
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royfellows wrote:

DylanW wrote:



I rather suspect that the thieving of copper cable could be part of the equation there.


The digging out of material used to block the adit- quite possible, the braking of locks & chains though no- as this was happening many years before the thiefing of copper ever started- so don't take me for a fool.

However i will say nothing further in regard
Of MO.

--

A sibrydodd yn welw ei wedd, rhowch garrag las ar fy medd, o chwaral y Penrhyn, lle' r euthym yn blentyn i'r gwaith.
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rols

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 04/07/2014 22:56:54
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Much to my personal disappointment I've not had chance to make it back up there since the change to access last year and disappearance of the FoC website. But has it been made obvious at the entrance as the procedure to gain access?

Reason I ask is since the disappearance of the FoC website I was puzzled as to what the new procedure was and had to ask.

That said, even if someone didn't know the procedure it would have taken far less effort to simply ask around rather than opt for what must have been a planned trip up there to attack the gate.

I can understand people considering it on caves / mines that a group has decided to restrict access to their own members and deliberately set out to exclude anyone not in their club, but not where there is no such restriction other than a little bit of planning beforehand to get the code. So it makes no sense.Confused

Rols.
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PeteJ

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 15:49:43
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Some years back, the old NPHT was approached about making it difficult for local young children to get into the levels at Nenthead. The proposed solution was 19mm bolts, as used by many other caving and mining groups.

When this was publicised, we got emails which were hostile to the idea. The language and threats in the emails were amazingly awful. Some of the objectors seemed to be borderline insane.

There is also a separate anarchist line of reasoning which argues that no mines should be ever gated.

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hymac580c

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Joined: 28/05/2007
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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 16:39:46
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Very interesting reading this post with all the speculative theores as to why and how it was done.
So I will add my own opinion.
Most likely it is possible that someone wanted to enter the mine armed with simply a HACKSAW that will cut easily thru mild steel hinges of the gate. But will not cut thru the ht steel of the lock.
A hacksaw with a fresh blade can shift thru mild steel in no time.

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Bellach dim ond swn y gwynt yn chwibian, lle bu gynt yr engan ar cynion yn tincian.
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Vanoord

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 17:01:38
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It should be possible to determine from the cut marks whether the damage was done with a hacksaw or a disc cutter - the marks will be different.

Given that - apparently - the hinges and the hinge pins were all cut off, this is not just a case of forced entry: it's pre-determined vandalism.

If it was done with a cordless angle-grinder, then no vehicle would have been required and unless the person(s) concerned was caught in the act, they would have been impossible to detect.

There seem to be a couple of possible reasons for the vandalism:

(i) Go Bellow has upset / annoyed someone and they've decided to make life difficult for them.

(ii) Someone is annoyed about the increased security about the access and has damaged the gate to make a point.


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jagman

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 17:27:48
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Peter Burgess wrote:

Isn't the internet a wonderful place? Now I know the most convenient tool to buy should I ever need to cut metal in a remote place. But I imagine anyone intent on doing this would work it out anyway. But no harm in making sure we know. Thumb Down


Twoddle

If you enjoy the hobby of cutting through gates this thread would teach you nothing.
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hymac580c

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 18:11:42
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Vanoord wrote:

It should be possible to determine from the cut marks whether the damage was done with a hacksaw or a disc cutter - the marks will be different.

Given that - apparently - the hinges and the hinge pins were all cut off, this is not just a case of forced entry: it's pre-determined vandalism.

If it was done with a cordless angle-grinder, then no vehicle would have been required and unless the person(s) concerned was caught in the act, they would have been impossible to detect.

There seem to be a couple of possible reasons for the vandalism:

(i) Go Bellow has upset / annoyed someone and they've decided to make life difficult for them.

(ii) Someone is annoyed about the increased security about the access and has damaged the gate to make a point.


Now that makes things a bit more complicated.

--

Bellach dim ond swn y gwynt yn chwibian, lle bu gynt yr engan ar cynion yn tincian.
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Vanoord

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 18:30:44
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jagman wrote:

Peter Burgess wrote:

Isn't the internet a wonderful place? Now I know the most convenient tool to buy should I ever need to cut metal in a remote place. But I imagine anyone intent on doing this would work it out anyway. But no harm in making sure we know. Thumb Down


Twoddle

If you enjoy the hobby of cutting through gates this thread would teach you nothing.


Indeed.

The cordless angle grinder has gone from useless curiosity to invaluable workshop tool in the last few years.

If you happen to want to keep somewhere secure (which I do) then portable angle grinders are the stuff of nightmares.

If, however, you want to get into places you shouldn't; or if you want to vandalise things; or if you want to steal things - then the portable angle grinder is all that you could ask Father Christmas for.

Gas axe man has, no doubt, become angle grinder man.

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Filling space until a new signature comes along...
IP: 81.139.182.201 Edited: 05/07/2014 18:31:29 by Vanoord
NewStuff

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 18:50:35
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Vanoord wrote:

Gas axe man has, no doubt, become angle grinder man.


Gas axes are still far superior to angle grinders, should you want to cut large amounts of metal with a comparatively low amount of noise. If you know how to use one properly, it's also a hell of a lot quicker. The downside is the weight. Even a MAPP setup is a fair chunk heavier than a grinder.

Before anyone does the old 2+2=22 addition (Yes, I'm looking at you Peter), I'm not advocating anything, I just happen to be a Welding Engineer by trade.



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IP: 86.129.83.152 Edited: 05/07/2014 18:51:24 by NewStuff
droid

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 19:13:15
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Better not mention Liquid nitrogen then....



OOOOO ******Blush
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Dark Prince

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Cwmorthin vandalism AGAIN
Posted: 05/07/2014 19:36:46
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All this talk of how wonderful cordless angle grinders are is tosh. I paid £200 for mine and its crap, Roy F saw it in action in Mid wales, the hacksaw was quicker!!. So should anyone catch cordless angle grinder man in action at Cwm, 'aquire' his grinder and pass it one to me!.

Keeping somewhere secure in this day and age is a right pain in the arse. Even harder when people with official access to said site leave the gates open.....

DP
IP: 87.113.134.196
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