Mine exploration, photographs and mining history for mine explorers, industrial archaeologists, researchers and historians Mine explorer and mining history videos on YouTube Connect with other mine explorers on Facebook
Tip: do not include 'mine' or 'quarry', search by name e.g. 'cwmorthin', use 'Sounds like search' if unsure of spelling

Advanced Search
'Sounds like search'
Quick a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r s t u v w x y z
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search
Tip: narrow down your search by typing more than one word and selecting 'Search for all words' or 'Exact search'

Search for any word
Search for all words
Exact search

Mine Exploration Forum

Author Victor coal saw
miner1985

Joined: 17/11/2007
Location: South Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 10:17:47
Reply |  Quote


This isa photo of a Victor Coal Saw does anyone on this site know anything about it (or even seen one in action)?

Tweak: link fixed
IP: 145.8.104.65 Edited: 31/07/2013 10:26:18 by (moderator)
christwigg

Avatar of christwigg

Joined: 20/02/2008
Location: Cleveland / North Yorkshire

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 10:51:54
Reply |  Quote
Theres a detailed description on the site the photo came from.


Victor coal saw

The prototype of the coal saw was first made in April 1955. The Victor coal saw is used to make a horizontal or shear cut in coal. This unit is very simple, cheap and light. It is shown in Fig. 80 and consists of

(a) Traversing tube

(b) Mounting carriage

(c) Reciprocator unit

(d) Cutter Bar

(e) Traversing gear unit

(f) 4 in dia. pilot and reamer bit with drill rod

(g) Double clamp

The traversing tube consists of a 3 in. diameter tube with rock teeth. It is supplied in variable lengths to suit different conditions. One end of the tube is usually fitted with an extension rock assembly.

The mounting carriage accommodates the reciprocator unit and a standard rotary drilling machine. The web drive chuck of the coal drilling machine is situated on the drive pin of the driving sleeve which in turn rotates the main driving socket at a speed of 410 r.p.m. To the main driving socket is incorporated a swash plate cam and on each side of the cam face there is a roller mounted on a pin and bush. The end of the main driving shaft is spined. so on rotating the cam housing the main shaft has a reciprocating action. This rotation is obtained by a spur gear lay shaft which rotates the cam housing at a speed of 236 r.p.m. The cam throw is 125 in. and for every 2.3 revs of the main shaft, the cutter bar traverses one complete axial reciprocation.

The cutter bar has a helical scroll wrapped along its entire length. The scroll contains milled slots into which are fitted 60 tungsten tipped picks with the square heads situated in the scroll. On the extreme end of the cutter bar the tungsten star cutter is screwed on to a Whitworth thread. The cutter bar rotates in a clockwise direction when observed from the machine end and care should be taken to make sure that the picks have their tungsten tips facing the direction of rotation.

The traversing gear unit is supplied with two different speeds to suit either hard or soft coal. These are so arranged as to obtain a rate of feed of 3-5 in. per minute or 5-6 in. per minute on rotating the crank handle at 50 r.p.m.

Installation

When a horizontal cut is required there are two methods of erecting the traversing tube, depending on the underground conditions.

Method No. 1

In headings up to 12 ft. wide an extension rack assembly can be fitted to the traversing tube (as shown in Fig. 80) and the tube then tightened across the heading.

Method No. 2

In places above 12 ft. wide it is advisable to do without the extension rack and mount the traversing tube between two vertical props.

Two double clamps hold the traversing tube in position on the vertical props and cutting takes place between these vertical props, which can be moved along when a cut longer than the traversing tube is required.

Erection and use of the equipment for cutting

The mounting carriage is first slid on to the traversing tube which is mounted in at a distance back from the coalface of 15 in.

A 4 in. diameter hole is then drilled to a depth of 4 ft. 6 in. with the hole centre 4 in. above the traversing tube.

The mounting carriage is then moved along the tube to a place immediately in front of the drilled hole. The cutter bar, with its 60 picks and star cutter is pushed in the hole and the reciprocator unit situated on the mounting carriage and secured in position by means of the single wing bolt fixing.

The drilling machine is next mounted on the carriage, positioned on the driving shaft of the reciprocator, and secured by the two clamps around the machine handles and tightened down by the two wing nuts. The traversing gear unit is next fitted and secured by means of the tee-bolt fixing.

Cutting can then commence by operating the drill and applying pressure to the crank handle of the traversing gear unit. An alternative method to horizontal cutting is to shear, or vertically cut, the coal by fixing the traversing tube between the roof and floor. It is advisable in this case to cut from the floor upwards to allow the cuttings to fall away from the cutter-bar during the operation.

The Victor coal saw is most popular on longwall faces in "Licensed Mines". About 40 of these machines are now in use on longwall faces to make horizontal cuts. The length of face does not exceed 40 yds., with an approximate output of 60-70 tons per shift. There is no reason, however, why longer faces should not be cut with this equipment, provided that the coal to be cut is not "woody".

The price of the machine is low compared with that of ordinary coal cutters. The approximate price of the whole unit, suitable for use in a working space of more than 12 ft. in width, is only £350.
IP: 145.8.104.65
miner1985

Joined: 17/11/2007
Location: South Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 10:55:25
Reply |  Quote
Thanks, yes I've read that description, sorry my post wasn't very clear. Just wondered if anyone had actually seen one in action. Believe they were in use in some of the small mines as late as the 1980's. IP: 81.152.94.130
christwigg

Avatar of christwigg

Joined: 20/02/2008
Location: Cleveland / North Yorkshire

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 11:01:11
Reply |  Quote
If we're off the internet and into the real world then i'm afraid I know nothing.

Hopefully some practical miners out there might be able to help. Smile
IP: 145.8.104.65
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 12:23:24
Reply |  Quote
I thought i read somewhere that they have an example in the Durham Miner`s Museum,
Any of you local boy`s been there,and can confirm one way or other if they do?
Or is it only books on the Victor Coal Saw they have.

Wish they were available at that price above today ,had a quote from an engineering company yesterday to manufacture one and certify it,as its basicly a new machine,in not been used since the early 80`s ,last used Parc Level,Rhiwfawr,Swansea Valley,
The quote came back at 200,000,possibly more,
Best start sharpening the Mandrels.lol.
IP: 81.154.50.65 Edited: 31/07/2013 12:30:35 by Ty Gwyn
miner1985

Joined: 17/11/2007
Location: South Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 31/07/2013 13:04:01
Reply |  Quote
If not held at the Durham site (I think it is mainly an online site) I beleive they have referenced The Scottish mining museum site. So any Scottish boys know anything about it? IP: 81.152.94.130
Coggy

Avatar of Coggy

Joined: 27/12/2008
Location: Birmingham

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 12/08/2013 22:46:29
Reply |  Quote
christwigg wrote:

Theres a detailed description on the site the photo came from.


Victor coal saw

The prototype of the coal saw was first made in April 1955. The Victor coal saw is used to make a horizontal or shear cut in coal. This unit is very simple, cheap and light. It is shown in Fig. 80 and consists of

(a) Traversing tube

(b) Mounting carriage

(c) Reciprocator unit

(d) Cutter Bar

(e) Traversing gear unit

(f) 4 in dia. pilot and reamer bit with drill rod

(g) Double clamp

The traversing tube consists of a 3 in. diameter tube with rock teeth. It is supplied in variable lengths to suit different conditions. One end of the tube is usually fitted with an extension rock assembly.

The mounting carriage accommodates the reciprocator unit and a standard rotary drilling machine. The web drive chuck of the coal drilling machine is situated on the drive pin of the driving sleeve which in turn rotates the main driving socket at a speed of 410 r.p.m. To the main driving socket is incorporated a swash plate cam and on each side of the cam face there is a roller mounted on a pin and bush. The end of the main driving shaft is spined. so on rotating the cam housing the main shaft has a reciprocating action. This rotation is obtained by a spur gear lay shaft which rotates the cam housing at a speed of 236 r.p.m. The cam throw is 125 in. and for every 2.3 revs of the main shaft, the cutter bar traverses one complete axial reciprocation.

The cutter bar has a helical scroll wrapped along its entire length. The scroll contains milled slots into which are fitted 60 tungsten tipped picks with the square heads situated in the scroll. On the extreme end of the cutter bar the tungsten star cutter is screwed on to a Whitworth thread. The cutter bar rotates in a clockwise direction when observed from the machine end and care should be taken to make sure that the picks have their tungsten tips facing the direction of rotation.

The traversing gear unit is supplied with two different speeds to suit either hard or soft coal. These are so arranged as to obtain a rate of feed of 3-5 in. per minute or 5-6 in. per minute on rotating the crank handle at 50 r.p.m.

Installation

When a horizontal cut is required there are two methods of erecting the traversing tube, depending on the underground conditions.

Method No. 1

In headings up to 12 ft. wide an extension rack assembly can be fitted to the traversing tube (as shown in Fig. 80) and the tube then tightened across the heading.

Method No. 2

In places above 12 ft. wide it is advisable to do without the extension rack and mount the traversing tube between two vertical props.

Two double clamps hold the traversing tube in position on the vertical props and cutting takes place between these vertical props, which can be moved along when a cut longer than the traversing tube is required.

Erection and use of the equipment for cutting

The mounting carriage is first slid on to the traversing tube which is mounted in at a distance back from the coalface of 15 in.

A 4 in. diameter hole is then drilled to a depth of 4 ft. 6 in. with the hole centre 4 in. above the traversing tube.

The mounting carriage is then moved along the tube to a place immediately in front of the drilled hole. The cutter bar, with its 60 picks and star cutter is pushed in the hole and the reciprocator unit situated on the mounting carriage and secured in position by means of the single wing bolt fixing.

The drilling machine is next mounted on the carriage, positioned on the driving shaft of the reciprocator, and secured by the two clamps around the machine handles and tightened down by the two wing nuts. The traversing gear unit is next fitted and secured by means of the tee-bolt fixing.

Cutting can then commence by operating the drill and applying pressure to the crank handle of the traversing gear unit. An alternative method to horizontal cutting is to shear, or vertically cut, the coal by fixing the traversing tube between the roof and floor. It is advisable in this case to cut from the floor upwards to allow the cuttings to fall away from the cutter-bar during the operation.

The Victor coal saw is most popular on longwall faces in "Licensed Mines". About 40 of these machines are now in use on longwall faces to make horizontal cuts. The length of face does not exceed 40 yds., with an approximate output of 60-70 tons per shift. There is no reason, however, why longer faces should not be cut with this equipment, provided that the coal to be cut is not "woody".

The price of the machine is low compared with that of ordinary coal cutters. The approximate price of the whole unit, suitable for use in a working space of more than 12 ft. in width, is only £350.

Is that from Viz comic ?

--

I grappled a graptolite
IP: 94.173.195.91
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 13/08/2013 00:00:44
Reply |  Quote
Not impressed?
For a Smallmine,consentrating on obtaining large coal sizes for housecoal,that`s one of the most versatile machines ever produced,
Low input power,reducing costs,
Light in weight can be carried from one stall to another,and cut main driveage top of roads,so every road produces saleable sizes at minimal costs.
IP: 86.158.229.72
Phil Ford

Joined: 01/05/2008
Location: Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 13/08/2013 07:51:03
Reply |  Quote
That is not a coal saw it is a Victor Drilling machine that has been put together the wrong way around. I used a Victor at Cronton Colliery in the 1960s boring 150ft water infusion holes. We also had one at Coed Talon Colliery for advance boring.
The picture shows a small twist drill fixed to the drilling rig, the Victor Drill was bigger and more powerful. It was mounted on the bar shown to drill to the right.
IP: 194.28.138.136
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 13/08/2013 09:42:58
Reply |  Quote
Phil,
When you say its put together the wrong way,how do you mean the wrong way?
It looks like the boring machine is at the end,with the blast inlet,and the borers handles can be seen,and i presume its the recipitor that is in front that secures the drill,

Regarding the drill shown,i agree,it does`nt look like a 4in drill,but seems bigger than a conventional coal drill.
IP: 86.170.220.118
Phil Ford

Joined: 01/05/2008
Location: Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 13/08/2013 14:58:57
Reply |  Quote
The it has been set up on the main bar at a right angle. the drill should be parallel to the bar. One end of the bar has a pointed end with a spring to help tension it in place the other end (shown) is the setting mechanism. Looking at the photo again I think that the coal boring machine shown is not part of the original drilling rig. With this machine I don't think that you could build it up correctly. At Coed Talon we had a set of connecting twist drills, they took a standard coal bit as well as a larger one that could be used to put in a stand pipe to drill through. IP: 194.28.138.136
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 14/08/2013 00:45:32
Reply |  Quote
I no doubt the Victor you used for advance boring was a bigger more powerful machine,or otherwise no doubt it would have jammed with gummings at the distance it was boring.

The Victor in the photo looks around the same power as a normal Huwood coal borer,and i cannot see it cutting a face if it was clamped parallel with the toothed bar,it would work on the same principal as a Router,winding it along the face,as in the diagram.
IP: 86.170.197.144
Phil Ford

Joined: 01/05/2008
Location: Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 14/08/2013 13:40:54
Reply |  Quote
We had no problem drilling a 30ft advance borehole in our main dip, there was a lot of water coming in the coal from the outcrop. That flowed out and cleared the hole. For drilling in stone or dry ground we had a 2inch rock bit and 6ft round Victor drill-rods with a hollow center for the water feed. IP: 194.28.138.136
exspelio

Joined: 02/05/2012
Location: peak district

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 14/08/2013 16:32:51
Reply |  Quote
Ty Gwyn wrote:

if it was clamped parallel with the toothed bar,it would work on the same principal as a Router,winding it along the face,as in the diagram.


I'd go along with this.

--

Always remember, nature is in charge, get it wrong and it is you who suffers!.
IP: 81.153.183.113
Phil Ford

Joined: 01/05/2008
Location: Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 14/08/2013 21:58:59
Reply |  Quote
The Victor Drilling machine had a drive on it that used the toothed bar when drilling. The drive was through a simple clutch, when the drilling rods where extracted we had to disengage the clutch and use the winding handle that is in the picture because it did not have a power return.
I do not think that it would have stood up to being used as a router, to use it as an under-cutter is a complete misunderstanding due to the pictured machine being re-built wrongly. There is a picture of a Victor in an old copy of Guide to The Coalfields I will try to find it and post the year published.
IP: 194.28.138.136
miner1985

Joined: 17/11/2007
Location: South Wales

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 14/08/2013 22:12:05
Reply |  Quote
Hi Phil - hope things are ok up North. How does what you are describing fit in with the description of how the machine was used to cut/saw the coal? IP: 109.154.175.145
Phil Ford

Joined: 01/05/2008
Location: Caernarfon

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 15/08/2013 07:49:13
Reply |  Quote
After operating a Victor for 18 months I cannot see anyway that you could cut coal with it. IP: 194.28.138.136
Ty Gwyn

Joined: 30/10/2009
Location: Lampeter

View Profile
View Posts
View Personal Album
View Personal Files
View all Photos
Send Private Message
Victor coal saw
Posted: 15/08/2013 09:46:23
Reply |  Quote
Phil,
The Victor you have used,must be totally different to the Victor Coal Saw,
The details above describe it was designed to be powered from a Victor coal borer,were a normal hole was bored in the coal,then the bigger drill with its teeth was bored into the hole,and put together as the details describe,

As far as i know Parc Level Colliery,up the mountain where i used to live,were the last to use this machine/contraption in the early 80`s when they went over to an AB15 undercutter,
And this was a very profitable Smallmine from when it started just before the 2nd WW.
IP: 86.170.192.87 Edited: 15/08/2013 10:45:16 by Ty Gwyn
Safety LED Miners Caplamps Moore Books: Specialist Books I.A. Recordings: Mining and Industrial History DVDs Starless River - Caving Store Explore a Disused Welsh Slate Mine
Disclaimer: Mine exploring can be quite dangerous, but then again it can be alright, it all depends on the weather. Please read the proper disclaimer.
© 2005 to 2015 AditNow.co.uk
Top of Page