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Mine Exploration Forum

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Author Fellows lamps forum.
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Posted: 20/01/2015 21:46:54
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Les, what's the output of that?

Most powerful I know to is Chris Cowdery's "Glowworm" I believe its outputs 12,000 lumens on max, but very rapidly spoils the fun by shutting down to a measly 7,000

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exspelio

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Posted: 21/01/2015 00:07:33
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Looks like a mean piece of kit Les - Homebuild? -, table top looks a bit "distressed" though! Laugh Laugh

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staffordshirechina

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Posted: 21/01/2015 07:56:06
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Not sure on the output, when it is on max output by pressing the override button, it puts all four beams on at once.
The LEDs are old tech now (s7 or p7 or something?).
I think it is around 1800 lumen, supposedly.
It does the job so I have not upgraded anything.
Built for work and slate mines.
All made or modified at home.
IP: 81.159.227.204
royfellows

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Posted: 25/01/2015 11:14:39
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I had a nice day out yesterday Saturday first call was Cambrian at Glyn Ceiriog, a real place to test lamps.

I had a lab rig of an XM-L behind a 28 mm reflector and an XP-L behind a 20 mm, series wired to same driver at 3 amps. By covering and uncovering each in turn in real conditions I was able to make an accurate as comparison as possible.

There is a lot of mileage in the XP-L behind a small reflector, throw was nearly as good as the other with better peripheral light. Opens possibility for smaller lamps with multiple LED arrays, but heat dissipation is a product of surface area, "You cant change the laws of physics Captain"

I see no advantage in making any changes to my mainstream lamps.

Wore the Dragon, this 'dark' mine put it to the test but was able to light up the caverns no problem. Its not a bat cooker by any means in the sense of my other lamps, but its part way there.

I had a good day walking and then finished up in Hendre Spa again with the Dragon. The lighter rock did not soak up the light in the way Cambrian does and the clever little thing was able to light this place up like day.
I hope that its successful, it could still fail tests on other issues.

--

He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
IP: 88.105.217.16 Edited: 25/01/2015 11:15:38 by royfellows
Mr Mike

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Posted: 02/02/2015 14:05:19
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Roy, what spot reflector are using with the XP-L Leds?

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royfellows

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Posted: 02/02/2015 19:15:10
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Mr Mike wrote:

Roy, what spot reflector are using with the XP-L Leds?


They described as suitability for XP-G not XP-L but same size emitter and they worked out well.

https://www.fasttech.com/p/1203501

I got the XP-Ls from the same source and was annoyed to find different colour temperatures. I am wondering if I got some warm white mixed in by accident.
I know your opinion of the Chinese but I have been ducking and diving with them for a few years now.
If you look at the price of the stuff, the little plastic LEDIL optics I use for Lynx pilots are about £1.50 with the VAT from Farnell, which is exorbitant.
These are nice little reflectors and only $1.81 US

I cannot find any reflectors dedicated to XP-L, which is probably why you asked?
Big Grin

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Mr Mike

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Posted: 02/02/2015 19:23:04
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Yes, some western companies are now making them for XP-Ls and by the way there is a big difference in using a optic designed for an XP-G on a XP-L, the beam is no way near as good.

Re colour temp, my first batch of XP-L's from Mouser, even though they are spec'ed at the same colour range as the XP-G's ended up being towards the higher temp side of the bin range - more cold.

I refuse to buy for production from Chinese suppliers. No continuity, no good data, bla bla, all been said before. Don't get me started....

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ChrisJC

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Posted: 02/02/2015 22:26:30
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royfellows wrote:

Les, what's the output of that?

Most powerful I know to is Chris Cowdery's "Glowworm" I believe its outputs 12,000 lumens on max, but very rapidly spoils the fun by shutting down to a measly 7,000


11,200 to be precise, but what's 800 lumens between friends*

Chris.

*Unless that's all you've got!
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royfellows

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Posted: 02/02/2015 22:27:49
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Mr Mike wrote:

Yes, some western companies are now making them for XP-Ls and by the way there is a big difference in using a optic designed for an XP-G on a XP-L, the beam is no way near as good.


I tried them with an XP-G and hit the old issue of no peripheral light. I was originally going to use XP-Gs in the Dragon at a lower drive current and feed the floods simultaneously at about 50 mA for peripheral.

I am actually well pleased with what I am getting from them in the Dragon.

This weekend the so called 'secret lamp testing' mentioned in another thread was just trying 2 series XP-Ls inside round headset, disappointingly no peripheral light.

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He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
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royfellows

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Posted: 03/02/2015 15:56:54
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Someone else s tests on XP-Ls using different reflectors

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/34154

Also, I have to make a point that whatever reflector is used its unlikely that it will be designed specifically for use in a mining or caving headtorch. I am a fanatic about peripheral light for good reason that if a user cant clearly see their own feet its a recipe for disaster.

A little story.
I have and am still using a hand lamp made years ago from a Maglite head using 3 P7s, remember those?
I initially used LEDIL reflectors purchased from Germany but found better results from using a Chinese 3 LED cast aluminium reflector designed for XR-Es which I bored out with a 12mm drill to take the P7s.

Anyway, I have just ordered some more XP-Ls, what I don't like is the variation in colour temperature so when the new batch arrive I will test everyone of them one by one.

I am getting to be a funny old sod in my old age.

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He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
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Tamarmole

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Posted: 03/02/2015 17:24:46
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royfellows wrote:

Someone else s tests on XP-Ls using different reflectors

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/34154

Also, I have to make a point that whatever reflector is used its unlikely that it will be designed specifically for use in a mining or caving headtorch. I am a fanatic about peripheral light for good reason that if a user cant clearly see their own feet its a recipe for disaster.

A little story.
I have and am still using a hand lamp made years ago from a Maglite head using 3 P7s, remember those?
I initially used LEDIL reflectors purchased from Germany but found better results from using a Chinese 3 LED cast aluminium reflector designed for XR-Es which I bored out with a 12mm drill to take the P7s.

Anyway, I have just ordered some more XP-Ls, what I don't like is the variation in colour temperature so when the new batch arrive I will test everyone of them one by one.

I am getting to be a funny old sod in my old age.


Only getting ?
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royfellows

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Posted: 05/02/2015 20:22:16
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A BLACK DAY FOR MY LAMPS

I am sad to inform that the one Trigon currently in stock is the last to be produced, I have four new Oldham headsets in stock earmarked for EcoStars. When they gone they gone as I seem to be unable to obtain further new Oldham headsets at an economically viable cost. The last large batch I had to travel to Trowbridge to collect, but managed a day in Box while down there.
I refuse to work on battered ex colliery relics but will convert to EcoStars any good headset supplied, that's the best I can offer.
Sad

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He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
IP: 2.100.143.173 Edited: 05/02/2015 20:23:10 by royfellows
royfellows

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Posted: 07/02/2015 17:43:24
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royfellows wrote:



I am sad to inform that the one Trigon currently in stock is the last to be produced,
Sad


Its gone!

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royfellows

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Posted: 16/02/2015 20:20:57
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Latest
I have components arriving shortly for the first batch of Dragons.
I was using mine this weekend and thought it was very good, but a companion had a Trigon which sort of put things in perspective.
Whatever else I produce the 'bat cookers' rule and always will.
End of.

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royfellows

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Posted: 06/03/2015 18:03:08
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The Dragon 800 is now in production and I have several in stock already, it happened earlier than expected.

There is a more powerful brother the Dragon 1200 on drawing board and some initial experiments have been very successful. Price is expected to be the same as the 800 model which some users will prefer due to the low voltage 'never go out' advantage, as the 1200 will be on serial cells.

It will encompass some very novel features, its great fun trying something that is completely 'outside the box' and finding that it not only works but works well and reliably.
I shall be producing 2 X Serial power packs for it as the output will be well reduced from my usual bat cooker but it will possibly appear nearly as bright because its magic!
Just like aikido the power comes from nowhere
This will also help keep the price down, as will a 'straight' mains adapter charger. 2S cells don't need fancy balance charging.

Thanks to Stu who has found a brand new Oldham headset in his garage, bless his cotton socks, I now have 5 EcoStars to be available shortly, unless some more headsets appear somewhere at an economic price it will be the end of the Oldhams.
Sad

I am working on a replacement for the Trigon based on the lightweight X1000 headset shell but with 2 Series beams and floods, the X2000. I am hoping to be able to offer a genuine bat cooker for £175 same as the old Trigon.

The specs are single toggle switch at rear giving either beams or floods through 3 modes, floods will run at low output alongside the beams to give good peripheral light, and it will have the 'nightrider' blue voltage indicator working off a gravity switch. Turn your helmet upside down to check the battery level, simples.

Early indications are of a weight of less than 200 grams, so it will be my lightest batcooker yet.
Could be available June.

The X3000 is proving good, the 2000 lumens beam max appears to be sustainable under all conditions, with the combined 3000 lumens sustainable under most conditions.
By sustainable I mean no thermal shutdown, run it until the battery gives up.

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He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
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Roy Morton

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Posted: 07/03/2015 03:26:43
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Your new bat roaster sounds like the biz Roy, I'm sure I'll be in touch later in the year. Big Grin

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royfellows

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Posted: 23/03/2015 15:40:31
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The Magic Dragon

I am now testing the first of the Dragon 1200s, "The Magic dragon", so christened because it really is magic.
An old say is that "There is never a second chance to make a first impression" , this is usually related to selling something but when once builds lamps the first impression is when one first try's out a new model underground.

I was at the NAMHO AGM on Saturday at Matlock and afterwards took the opportunity to try it it in Devonshire Cavern. Of all the lamps I have built to date this is the most impressive. I thought the other one was good but this one really does it. Its difficult to describe, but walk mode is a fairly overall even lighting effect and very crisp.



(click image to open full size image in new window)

I have built it around 4 X Cree XP-G2 S2 emitters, two in series behind reflectors, two in series mounted on the inside of each reflector just inside the rim. These are switched independently to rum on a single mode of 150 mA and produce just under 150 lumens as far as I can calculate. They also run in combination with the beams at 60mA.
It looks a lot more because most of the light is being directed down at the floor. Using them independently for bolting or similar just tilt the lamp upwards.

I consider foot level illumination very important with XP-Gs because the beams from these are very tight with an almost total cutoff.

The beams are at three modes. 170 mA is the standard or walk mode plus the floods on a low level to give a battery hit of about 210 mA, then there is a medium, and a maximum if 1.4 amps to the beams plus the same 60mA to the floods.

The maximum power I calculate at about 1175 lumens, and whats more initial testing indicates a heat sustainable output.

In use its impressive to say the least, it weighs nothing and does everything. I have designed a new 2 Series Li Ion power pack same size and weight as for the D800, standard mode should run for about 12 hours at which point the lamp will unfortunately suddenly die.

I am in truth niggled by the abysmal efficiency of the flood driver, but I am very limited by space. Upper half carries the toggle switch with the only room is on each side of it, lower half is filled by the main switch mode driver, inductor coil and all. To make matters worse a lot of the simple linear drivers have too high a minimum voltage being primarily designed for auto applications, this severely limits choice. But I bet Mike will come in with a "try this one Roy"
Big Grin

The flood emitters are bare XP-Gs to which I solder anode and cathode wires plus a little bit of flat copper to the central heat pad. I then carefully face it down with a fine warding file before mounting it on a little heat transfer insulation pad on the inside of the reflector. Heat transfer I regard as dodgy but at a max of 150 mA is irrelevant, well fresh battery gives about 190 for what difference.

I wont be producing these to sell for a while as I need to test exhaustively due to breaking into new ground with this lamp. Up until now they have all followed tried and tested design.

--

He told me 'I seem to eat batteries”. No wonder he has a bad stomach.
IP: 2.98.225.205 Edited: 23/03/2015 15:43:49 by royfellows
Roy Morton

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Posted: 24/03/2015 18:53:34
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Looks and sounds like a great piece of kit Roy, Can't wait to see one in the flesh.
Power to you elbow, and may your 'Magic Dragon' never go puffLaugh

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royfellows

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Posted: 24/03/2015 20:41:02
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I am stuck for delivery of a load of XMLs so decided to put another D1200 together, such is my confidence!

I put the test model on at standard mode about quarter to eight this morning and just come back from karate and its still going, all 250 lumens of it.

I shall be up at Nenthead Easter and will try it on the Caplecleugh Smallcleugh through trip, the 'fish route'.
They are seriously tough little bits of kit.

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royfellows

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Posted: 25/03/2015 17:20:47
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Roy Morton wrote:

and may your 'Magic Dragon' never go puffLaugh


powering up the second one built find that I wired supplementary driver circuit backwards, but not go "puff" thanks to Mr Schottky
Figure that one
Laugh


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