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Mine Exploration Forum

Author Water Engines
gNick

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 10:26:14
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Could anyone point me in the direction of anything useful about water engines used in mines, particularly for winding?
Obviously there's the one in Sir Francis Level but I am wondering about required head and flow rates.


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AdM Michael

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Posted: 02/04/2019 11:49:42
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This might help if you can get it to work.

https://www.ifg.tu-clausthal.de/fileadmin/wass/wass_how-d.html#ADWN
IP: 109.41.66.65
AdM Michael

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 11:57:55
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Also available:

steam loco
steam engine
Waterwheel with winder and manengine

https://www.ifg.tu-clausthal.de/fileadmin/heus/heus_how-d.html

https://www.ifg.tu-clausthal.de/fileadmin/damp/damp_how-d.html

http://www.gbv.de/dms/clausthal/E_BOOKS/2007/2007EB169/index.html#AFKN

IP: 109.41.66.65
gNick

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 12:54:32
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AdM Michael wrote:

This might help if you can get it to work.

https://www.ifg.tu-clausthal.de/fileadmin/wass/wass_how-d.html#ADWN


Not at work I can't. I can't read it either but Google translate will probably make it slightly better...


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AdM Michael

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 14:45:11
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It should be a full simulation of a waterpressure engine coupled to winder which will give you readings for flow, pressure, speed, ...
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ChrisJC

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 14:45:27
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Doug Self has an enormous quantity of information on water powered engines.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/POWER/waterengine/waterengine.htm

Specifically here are the two at Wanlockhead:
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/POWER/waterengine/waterengine2.htm#dean
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/POWER/waterengine/waterengine3.htm#hast

His museum of retro tech might appeal to some.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/museum.htm

Chris.

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sinker

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 15:06:02
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ChrisJC wrote:



His museum of retro tech might appeal to some.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/museum.htm




Oh great....thanks a bunch for that Chris Cursing Cursing Cursing

I'm trying to wean myself off the internet and this new web site that you just introduced me to is going to keep me tied up for years Laugh Laugh Surrender



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Jim MacPherson

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 16:20:14
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I misconstrued your initial post gNick, if you had said Male Water Sheep as I believe the hydraulic ram has been mistranslated...

Anyway I think there was a little one at Barjarg;



Now restored and looking a bit better but not for winding.

http://www.futuremuseum.co.uk/collections/people/lives-in-key-periods/empire-industry/the-industrial-revolution/water-wheel-and-pump-from-dumfries.aspx


Jim

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ChrisJC

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 16:27:53
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sinker wrote:

ChrisJC wrote:



His museum of retro tech might appeal to some.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/museum.htm




Oh great....thanks a bunch for that Chris Cursing Cursing Cursing

I'm trying to wean myself off the internet and this new web site that you just introduced me to is going to keep me tied up for years Laugh Laugh Surrender



I know. It's an amazing site!! I've wasted quite a bit of my life reading it. Blush

Chris.
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ttxela

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 16:58:15
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Jim MacPherson wrote:

I misconstrued your initial post gNick, if you had said Male Water Sheep as I believe the hydraulic ram has been mistranslated...



Which is, of course, where you get wire wool from.....
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gNick

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Water Engines
Posted: 02/04/2019 17:54:28
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Lots of nice things to look at (steam motorbikes anyone) at but the specific is whether a winch could realistically be driven from 25-30m head or ~45psi. I could design one that would but that isn't the same thing.

I'll see if I can run the simulator when I get home.



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gNick

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Posted: 02/04/2019 22:25:49
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Sort of a theoretical musing about a pipe.

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allanr

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Posted: 02/04/2019 23:20:50
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That wouldn't be the one we looked at on Sunday would it? IP: 79.64.85.9
gNick

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Water Engines
Posted: 03/04/2019 12:55:07
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It could be...


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JeremyL

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Water Engines
Posted: 03/04/2019 16:53:19
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The winding engine at Wanlockhead is on the adit level of new Glencrieff, it gets it water from an old level high up Glencrieff giving it a head of 165 Mts., this is probable due to the fact that the old level was convenient placed to deliver the water to the winder. A good description can be found in the Encyclopaedia Britannica 1911 page 94 and some general info from the Proceedings of the institute of mechanical engineers 1874 page 484 to 493. just out of interest the hydraulic pump engine on the same site has a head of water of 132 feet. Hope this helps. Jeremy IP: 86.163.82.230 Edited: 03/04/2019 16:54:41 by JeremyL
grahami

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Location: Telford, Shropshire

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Water Engines
Posted: 03/04/2019 23:27:14
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Mmm.. an interesting site on water power, he's added quite a bit to it since I was looking at it for water motors/turbines to drive the double Hunter tunneller a few years ago. He does seem to have missed the Amos & Francis 1859 patent pumping engines which were used at Penrhyn Quarry (and probably nowhere else) though. Contrary to the caption on the picture, and my own caption, we now have evidence both engines were constructed by Easton & Amos. The engine in the picture is the "No.2"
From the I.C.E. Minutes of 1877:
1877 Vol 50 January I.C.E. Minutes Discussion: The History of the modern development of water-pressure machinery.
The largest three-cylinder engines which he (Mr.Rice) knew were some made for Lord Penrhyn by Messrs. Eastons and Amos in 1869. The cylinders were 11.3 inches in diameter by 3 feet 6 inches stroke ; they worked under a water pressure of 190 feet at 17 revolutions per minute, and drove a set of large 3-throw pumps in a slate-mine shaft 120 feet deep.
They had been worked constantly for the last eight years with great success ; and latterly, another set of similar machinery had been erected at the same place.
If, however, the work had been intermittent instead of constant, it was a question whether turbines, or partial turbines, would not have answered the purpose at a smaller first cost.
As it was, the engines had acted admirably, and had cost very little for repairs.


Thanks to Tim Oulton for pointing out this reference.

The date for the first engine is incorrect - I'll post the correction when I can find my notes!
Grahami

1920s Photo


(click image to open full size image in new window)

Original Patent (From the "Engineer")


(click image to open full size image in new window)

Remaining frame of No.1 Engine at surface, 2004.


(click image to open full size image in new window)

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