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Mine Exploration Forum

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Author Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 14:06:29
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Counting the blocks gives a height of 1.3 metres for the LH wall, about 900 mm for the lower one. IP: 86.180.171.44
royfellows

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Joined: 13/06/2007
Location: Great Wyrley near Walsall

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 14:17:46
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More work, mainly cladding has increased the height, both are now equal.



(click image to open full size image in new window)

I have to admit that although I am personally aware that I am on a public council road when I walk up from the car park, I do feel uneasy due to the presence of that 'structure'. As though its a private road and I should not be there, although in law as a public road I have a right to drive my car up it. How would anyone else feel?
This is not right.

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Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 14:34:02
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Personally I would feel OK and just drive through. The worrying bit would be if he fitted a gate and the council took the view that a saving could be made if the road was no longer maintainable at their expense. IP: 86.180.171.44
royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 14:46:13
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Morlock wrote:

Personally I would feel OK and just drive through. The worrying bit would be if he fitted a gate and the council took the view that a saving could be made if the road was no longer maintainable at their expense.


I dont think that they are allowed to do that. Anyway, as I understand it a public highway is such and remains as such, but there is a difference between different types of traffic allowed to use it, eg pedestrian only, all vehicle etc. Obviously that section of road is an all vehicle public highway whether adopted or not. The PROW blocked with landfill is a pedestrian only public highway, and as I understand it has a legal width of 4 feet.
I did a bit of research on all this and this is my current understanding of the law.

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Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 15:01:28
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I hope you're right Roy. One of the old tricks was to fit a gate but leave it open, same sort of intimidation tactic as the walls.

IIRC there is a gated road (both ends) somewhere around Nantlle in North Wales, most non locals turn around instead of opening the gate and pressing on.
IP: 86.180.171.44 Edited: 11/05/2018 15:28:00 by Morlock
royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 15:06:07
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Permission is required from local Highways Authority to put a gate on a public road. I would say its unlikely to be given unless there to contain grazing stock. I have noticed of late a lot of the gates have been replaced by cattle grids.

People do get away with things until someone reports it.

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sinker

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 15:56:21
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Morlock wrote:



The worrying bit would be if he fitted a gate and the council took the view that a saving could be made if the road was no longer maintainable at their expense.



I've been involved with this kind of thing in the past and that would never happen in this case. A "Stopping Up Order" to close a public highway is a very serious piece of legislation and is very rarely used as most highways have been in existence in one form or other for hundreds of years and it is virtually impossible for anyone to prove a case strongly enough to get an order passed. When they are used, they take years to implement due to the public consultation process that needs to happen. The only time they get used these days is when a bypass or road improvement scheme renders the old road unusable or when an area is redeveloped and an old road is closed and abandoned after the developer has built or paid for an alternative.





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Ah, well, now, you see.... IP: 82.132.236.197
Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 16:15:58
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sinker wrote:

Morlock wrote:


The only time they get used these days is when a bypass or road improvement scheme renders the old road unusable


That's what happened to this particular road when the by-pass was built, just a dead end stub left at Cefn Rhigos end.
IP: 86.180.171.44
sinker

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 16:29:59
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Morlock wrote:

sinker wrote:

Morlock wrote:


The only time they get used these days is when a bypass or road improvement scheme renders the old road unusable


That's what happened to this particular road when the by-pass was built, just a dead end stub left at Cefn Rhigos end.


Right. So it has been Stopped Up where it was crossed by the by-pass? Doubt that they would truncate it even further though?


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Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 16:48:12
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sinker wrote:

Morlock wrote:

sinker wrote:

Morlock wrote:


The only time they get used these days is when a bypass or road improvement scheme renders the old road unusable


That's what happened to this particular road when the by-pass was built, just a dead end stub left at Cefn Rhigos end.


Right. So it has been Stopped Up where it was crossed by the by-pass? Doubt that they would truncate it even further though?


General opinion seems to indicate it would a very unlikely event.

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royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 17:06:11
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I would not worry too much about the road people. It is a much easier route that the usual one, walking the whole distance from the car park. Its just that the divers will have a much easier job if they can drive up and drop off their kit and passengers at the start of the PROW, its then barely 400 metres of flat walking to the footbridge.

Actually, quite a nice walk with some good views.

I can see us winning this one anyway.

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NeilC

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 21:17:46
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If he gates it, maintains the road, verge etc for 12 years with no objections then he can claim 'adverse possession' and it will become his property.Wub IP: 149.241.130.13
sinker

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 21:44:37
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NeilC wrote:

If he gates it, maintains the road, verge etc for 12 years with no objections then he can claim 'adverse possession' and it will become his property.Wub


Not quite that easy unfortunately. Adverse Possession requires 30 years in the case of Crown land, eg roads, council owned land, local authority housing, MOD land etc etc.
Thinking of claiming Adverse Possession on a piece of Crown foreshore? Forget it. 60 years!! Laugh


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JohnnearCfon

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 11/05/2018 22:33:33
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sinker wrote:

NeilC wrote:

If he gates it, maintains the road, verge etc for 12 years with no objections then he can claim 'adverse possession' and it will become his property.Wub


Not quite that easy unfortunately. Adverse Possession requires 30 years in the case of Crown land, eg roads, council owned land, local authority housing, MOD land etc etc.
Thinking of claiming Adverse Possession on a piece of Crown foreshore? Forget it. 60 years!! Laugh


Even if adverse possession were possible that would still not extinguish any public right of way.
IP: 86.166.105.226
Wormster

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 12/05/2018 20:47:48
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The problem with blocking/restricting access to what little PROW's exists, is that once a PROW is downgraded there is very little chance of it being reversed. Take a look at the battle between the T.R.F. and "Red Sock Brigade" (I won't stand on the hose)

EVERY restriction to what remains NEEDS to be challenged!

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IP: 86.184.162.239
royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 19/07/2018 08:25:03
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Does anyone have any news at all of developments regarding the Public Right of Way to the mine, the partially constructed gateway on the public road, or current water levels in the mine?

I live miles away and would like updates from anyone visiting the site.

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Morlock

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 19/07/2018 13:53:51
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I might have some info regarding water levels over the weekend.
IP: 86.181.251.197
royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 19/07/2018 13:57:35
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John, could you take a walk up the road and see what the situation is with the 'gates' and the PROW. Its only 10 minutes, seriously easy way to the mine.

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ttxela

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 19/07/2018 15:40:00
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Hello Roy

I was there a couple of weeks ago and the water levels were a bit lower than usual but not dramatically so.

IP: 89.197.175.9
royfellows

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Craig -y -Dinas Upper Silica Mine
Posted: 19/07/2018 15:49:33
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Thanks Alex.
Did you notice whether 'checkpoint Charley' was still there across the council road just above the car park?

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IP: 88.106.237.14
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